(((My Fellow Americans))) #90: Travis Wentworth PhD

DISCLOSURE

FULL TRANSCRIPT TEXT

02:00
i’ll be
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buried in my grave
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before
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[Music]
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way back in the
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[Music]
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[Music]
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change
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[Music]
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before i
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[Music]
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that is
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[Music]
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but it seems like since
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[Music]
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we have sorely changed
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[Music]
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oh
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and now i’m from beautiful myrtle beach
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south carolina you’re watching my
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fellow americans with your host
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spike yes
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yes it’s me it’s me
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thank you so much for joining us keep
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clapping
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clap for the bitcoin miracle
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how would we know that you wanted the
04:28
bitcoin miracle
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if you didn’t keep clapping welcome to
04:32
my fellow americans i
04:33
am literally spike cohen thank you so
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much for tuning in
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uh for this amazing episode on this
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amazing day which is wednesday the
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i believe 17th there we go 17th uh thank
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you so much for tuning in we have a
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really cool
04:48
episode uh if you were wondering uh
04:50
questions about blockchain such as
04:52
what even is the blockchain this is the
04:55
show for you this is of course a muddy
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thank you so much joe davi i’d like to
09:10
thank
09:13
for this delicious pure ultra pure why
09:15
is that not
09:16
i don’t know why that’s not focusing
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this ultra pure drinking water that i
09:19
drink on this
09:20
and many episodes not not all of them
09:23
but
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many probably most episodes of my fellow
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americans bulavanaka
09:30
i’m actually parched i needed that i’m
09:32
going to be drinking a lot of this
09:33
tonight
09:34
shout out to taran turks and mom and him
09:35
as always folks before i begin the show
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i’d like to address uh the fact that um
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the most successful uh broadcaster
09:44
in um or successful host
09:47
in the world of talk radio passed away
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today rush limbaugh
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um rush is someone that i used to
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actually listen to many many many years
09:56
ago back when i was a conservative
09:58
um and as i said he was the most
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successful
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in terms of his longevity how long his
10:04
show went on
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how many how much how successful his
10:07
ratings were
10:08
and sustained uh and the fact that he
10:10
would do a daily
10:11
three hour long program uh often without
10:14
any
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more often than not without any guess
10:16
which i can’t even
10:18
imagine talking for three hours a day
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for actually i
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probably do do that but i he did that
10:23
live on the radio
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uh five days a week for uh longer than a
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lot of the people watching this have
10:29
been alive
10:30
there are many many things i do not
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agree with rush limbaugh on
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um and there are many things that i
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disagreed with uh
10:37
vehemently with him on uh and and there
10:39
are plenty of times
10:40
that we can talk about that uh but one
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thing i do want to say is that rush
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limbaugh was the major influence
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on matt wright the man who uh co-founded
10:50
and
10:50
is the co-owner of muddy waters media so
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there is
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it could easily be said that muddy
10:55
waters media would not exist today
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were it not for rush limbaugh and uh if
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for no other reason then i i choose to
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bring him up and of course i’m sure that
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he is uh very much missed by his loved
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ones and i
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hope that he rests in peace and i pray
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that his memory is a great blessing to
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everyone whose lives that he touched so
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uh with that said
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my guest tonight is an expert on cyber
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security
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cryptocurrency in the blockchain he is a
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co-owner and an instructor at
11:24
intelligence quest where he provides a
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variety of clientele
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with training on network infrastructure
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and security his background is in
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acquisition
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and analysis of public and proprietary
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data he has published
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peer-reviewed articles in computer
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modeling
11:39
catalysis programming network
11:42
data acquisition and security and he is
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now going to explain
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what all of that means because i cannot
11:48
ladies and gentlemen
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my fellow americans please welcome to
11:51
the show mr travis
11:53
wentworth travis thanks so much for
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coming on man thank you so much thanks
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for the amazing intro i appreciate it
11:59
absolutely listen i i’m excited to have
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you on when i was putting together my
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questions for you
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a sense of calm came over me because
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i know just enough about the subjects
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that we’re about to talk about
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to talk fairly intelligently about them
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for somewhere between three to five
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minutes um and so basically
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this whole episode i’m just gonna say
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words to you and then say
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tell me what this means so so thank you
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for that
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what is this one of those uh puzzles
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where you just fill the words in and we
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just we just go from there
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it’s like mad libs except in reverse i
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say the word and then you have to
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explain what it means
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um so thank you for that thank you for
12:37
coming on and folks be sure to comment
12:38
with your thoughts and questions we are
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live and travis and i will tell you
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if you are right or wrong you’re you
12:45
might be wrong because
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this is going to be we’re talking about
12:47
a lot of stuff here you might be right i
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don’t know who knows
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um but before we get started what even i
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i always ask my guests when i when you
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know they come on and they’re they’re so
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you know
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in-depth and experts on their various
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respective fields what got you into this
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like why are you in the technological
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field
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what what what inspired you to get into
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that yeah so i’ve always been kind of an
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engineering type first and foremost
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and i think so my phd is actually in
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chemical engineering
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and so we were doing um modeling of
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catalytic systems and so catalysis
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is what my phd was in heterogeneous
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catalysis
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and um so just so just to
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i of course know what catalysis is
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because
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come on but for those who may not know
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what that what exactly is that
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it’s uh it’s how you make chemical
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reactions go right so
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they’re hard it’s hard to make these
13:35
reactions go and so what you do is you
13:37
use a catalyst
13:38
you use something to drive the reactions
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forward right and
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a really great example that is your car
13:43
right your catalytic converter in your
13:44
car
13:45
that is a heterogeneous catalyst it’s a
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solid catalyst
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that works to drive gas phase reactions
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and that’s exactly what i was working on
13:52
i was actually looking at
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reducing emissions in diesel cars we
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were looking at modeling those
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infrastructures
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okay and yeah and we were building
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systems to like to
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do the actual physical reactions it’s
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pretty cool cool
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and so obviously the next step to that
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would be
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cyber security what what got what you
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know that’s what started you was in
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chemical engineering what got you into
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like
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you know computer modeling and
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networking and cyber security and that
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and blockchain and that kind of stuff
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yeah so when you’re like a technologist
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right most of the time you’re kind of
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interested in a lot of stuff and so at
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that time i was actually doing a lot of
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computer networking
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um so i’ve held like some computer
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networking certifications all the way
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back to like 2008
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i was kind of doing computer networking
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um computer modeling
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some physical reactions and kind of all
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of it at once right
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and so i was looking to come back from
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sweden i was doing a postdoctoral
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research fellowship in sweden
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in uh okay in reactions chemical
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engineering and that type of stuff
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and uh when i came back i had the
14:50
opportunity to go to jump straight into
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computer networking and cyber security a
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space i had been in for years and years
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uh kind of half in one half in the other
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and so
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uh in 2017 i came back
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stateside and started doing cyber
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security and network infrastructure
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training and consulting full-time
15:09
and so the last piece is okay well then
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how does that relate to
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cryptocurrency blockchain these
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technologies right right right
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and it turns out the fundamentals of
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bitcoin are actually based on
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traditional cybersecurity principles
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okay okay so that’s what got you into
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that now
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starting off with our questions here
15:30
we’re going to have many guests who you
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know we get we hear a lot about
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blockchain and cryptocurrency
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and it’s probably best in in best
15:39
service to
15:40
my viewers to ask what i’m sure half of
15:42
them are wondering
15:43
but often may be scared to ask which is
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this
15:47
what even is blockchain and
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cryptocurrency can you give us like a
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real before we get into the details can
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you give us like a real basic primer on
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what that even is
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yeah so the most important thing about
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blockchain right about
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uh blockchains is that they’re ledgers
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right they’re ledgers of transactions in
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the case of bitcoin
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right right so it’s literally just a a
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ledger of transactions uh one
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piece of value one bitcoin was
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transferred from this wallet
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to that wallet from this wallet to that
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wallet
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and it’s a ledger of transactions and
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then you might say well
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why how does that have value right why
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why are we talking about it then
16:22
and so actually your entire life is
16:25
transactional
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right here your transaction value from
16:28
yourself to a merchant
16:29
that merchant is transacting value from
16:31
a merchant to a supplier
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that supplier is is transacting and
16:36
sending that value
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to their employees right everything in
16:39
our society is transactional
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and so as of right now right most of
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that value transaction
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is verified by entities banks
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and central governments and swift and
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ach and these networks of banks and
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credit companies
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right right and so the value in
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blockchain at least
16:58
in the bitcoin discussion right is that
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we don’t have to trust
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that infrastructure to hold that ledger
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for us anymore
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right and so now we can we can take and
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have this
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distributed ledger this decentralized
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ledger that we all agree on
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right and so there’s a bunch of
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cryptographic principles that allow us
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to do this
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but the blockchain is this decentralized
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ledger
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that allows us all to agree like yep
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everybody
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transacted on this ledger and i sent
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spike some money and
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spike sent me some bitcoin and we all
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agree that it happened and we could we
17:30
can get into a little bit more depth
17:31
about it but that’s the that’s the
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the real value prop is that this is
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value transfer without you know some
17:38
centralized entity having to verify
17:40
every single thing
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and so this is what they talk about when
17:44
they say it’s a trustless system
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because you’re not having to trust the
17:48
person you’re transacting with
17:49
you don’t have to trust some centralized
17:51
system that is telling you no no we got
17:53
it all taken care of don’t worry about
17:54
it like you said like hch
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and other bank-driven centralized
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systems
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you don’t have to trust anyone there is
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you can trust the fact that there is a
18:02
a decentralized ledger that literally
18:05
everyone
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can look at in fact you can actually
18:07
download the ledger and you can actually
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see and look at with precision every
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single transaction
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that’s happening which is why when
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people will say well can it be hacked
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it really can’t because there’s it’s
18:20
simultaneously
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all in one and individually owned by
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everyone involved every single person
18:27
you would have to try to hack every
18:29
single person on earth’s version of the
18:32
the ledger in real time uh in before
18:34
anyone could catch that it was happening
18:36
so no way it really
18:37
to that extent can’t be hacked or if it
18:40
could it would require
18:41
so much energy and so much literal
18:43
actual power
18:44
uh processing power to even attempt to
18:46
do in any real way
18:48
that it would long you know it would
18:50
stop
18:51
to be able to to illegitimately buy a
18:54
chaise
18:55
lounge on overstock you would have to
18:57
spend
18:58
hundreds of billions of dollars in
19:00
resources it wouldn’t happen like it
19:02
just
19:02
you can’t it’s impossible to do so you
19:05
know unfortunately um
19:06
as we were talking um as you know
19:10
uh bitcoin just crashed to uh fifty two
19:13
thousand three hundred and twenty two
19:14
dollars
19:15
uh uh us dollar uh bitcoin is now dead
19:19
um why were we so wrong what were we so
19:22
why how are we how were we
19:23
so wrong about bitcoin unbelievable
19:27
right so the question
19:28
so you’re talking about the value
19:30
appreciation right
19:31
right how are we how were so many people
19:33
so wrong about the appreciation of the
19:35
asset as well right
19:36
how could we have been so wrong people
19:37
like buffett and stuff yeah yeah
19:40
well i mean he’s he’s right it’s dead
19:41
look look at it like i mean
19:43
it’s over like the the the coin i mean
19:46
all those gold balls
19:47
right it was worth 52 375 earlier in the
19:51
day and now
19:52
i mean it’s done give me my dollars back
19:57
give me my 50 back bitcoin
20:00
so no okay so let’s let i had to bring
20:02
that up because it’s
20:03
i’m flexing a little bit um so
20:07
we hear a lot about well let’s talk
20:09
about crypto because i mean
20:12
one thing that we we often hear is well
20:14
why bitcoin
20:16
and why ethereum or you know why these
20:18
these couple of of
20:20
some of the main players why not some
20:22
other one that might be faster or
20:23
cheaper to use or whatever
20:25
let’s talk about that a little bit coin
20:27
is not the most technologically advanced
20:29
of all of all the different
20:31
cryptocurrencies by a by a
20:33
long shot like i mean there are some
20:34
major structural uh deficits there
20:37
which can be addressed but they haven’t
20:38
yet um and some argue that they don’t
20:41
have to be yet but regardless there are
20:43
ones that are
20:44
more you know efficient and cheaper to
20:46
use and so forth
20:47
why obviously bitcoin was the first one
20:50
to come out and was the only one for for
20:51
at least a few years but that was
20:53
long ago in in in the time of of
20:55
cryptocurrency that was relatively early
20:57
on
20:57
why is bitcoin the
21:00
undisputed king of of crypto what what
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what
21:04
why is that yeah so you hit on something
21:06
earlier which was the adoption
21:08
level right so the first thing is when
21:10
you have so many nodes so many computers
21:13
so many people
21:14
invested in the infrastructure that
21:16
makes it more secure
21:17
right and so one of the best uh quotes
21:19
i’ve ever heard i think it was from
21:21
pompliano uh
21:22
anthony pompliano but he said you know
21:23
what you’re really investing in or what
21:25
you’re really banking on with bitcoin is
21:27
that it’s the most secure
21:28
computer network on the planet he
21:30
touched on that as well right security
21:32
and so the value prop let’s say a
21:34
bitcoin
21:35
which is you know not the most
21:37
technologically advanced of the
21:39
blockchains
21:39
it’s not a smart contract infrastructure
21:41
it doesn’t do these other things right
21:43
the transactions per second
21:45
are slow right so we kind of hit on the
21:47
bad things let’s talk about the good
21:48
stuff right
21:48
yeah um so the the value prop is that it
21:51
is the most secure computer network on
21:53
the planet right
21:54
the idea that you know other things have
21:57
value and that store value like
21:59
gold and we we touched on this in the
22:00
end in in our
22:02
pre-show right was the the the
22:04
difference between let’s say
22:06
gold and bitcoin as a store of value
22:08
right why is this
22:09
why is it such a valuable technology
22:11
versus some of these other things right
22:13
and so bitcoin is
22:16
is inherently more secure than all of
22:19
these other things
22:20
right and so what bitcoin does well it
22:23
does better than anybody
22:24
and so that’s the real value prop in my
22:26
opinion right is ethereum
22:28
cardano tazos these are all other block
22:31
chains
22:32
right and so that’s actually different
22:33
than some of these coins and we’ll we’ll
22:35
probably get into it
22:36
other things like i don’t know celsius
22:38
or chain link or whatever right those
22:39
are those are right
22:40
uh tokens right which is different from
22:43
coins which are blockchains
22:45
right yeah i i actually do want i do
22:47
want to get into that briefly at the end
22:48
but go ahead
22:49
yeah so but the blockchains themselves
22:51
so you’d say so why don’t we use
22:53
something like
22:54
cardano that has higher transactions per
22:55
second lower network fees than
22:57
ethereum and bitcoin right well bitcoin
22:59
has won the largest network effect
23:01
and in technology we know that network
23:03
effect is easily the most important
23:05
thing
23:06
just ask facebook twitter instagram
23:08
right
23:09
network effect wins uh you know a 99
23:13
times out of 100 right
23:14
and so it has one the network to support
23:16
it and two
23:17
it does the one thing well that it needs
23:19
to do well
23:20
right which is store value and be secure
23:24
that’s the only thing that it does right
23:26
is there is no way
23:27
for you to trans transfer one bitcoin
23:30
from one wallet to another wallet
23:32
without it being verified and signed by
23:34
your private key which is kind of the
23:36
cryptographic solution that we use to do
23:38
this there is no way for you to double
23:40
spend that bitcoin
23:41
which is the second big problem right
23:44
and so if we can verify the transactions
23:46
and we can prevent the double spend
23:47
which is
23:48
you sending a bitcoin here and sending a
23:50
bitcoin there we’ve
23:51
solved this store a value problem and
23:54
bitcoin does that the best
23:55
and you see that with price appreciation
23:58
you see that with
23:59
uh investor buy-in with corporate with
24:02
corporate adoption
24:03
you will probably see that with
24:04
governmental adoption at some point in
24:05
some smaller governments and things like
24:07
this
24:07
because it does that value store so
24:10
effectively
24:10
so that’s why in this cryptocurrency
24:12
space when you look at market cap
24:14
when you look at adoption when you look
24:15
at the first person in to cryptocurrency
24:17
they’re always in bitcoin usually right
24:20
is because it is the alpha and the omega
24:22
of the value prop which is the store of
24:24
value
24:25
right it does it better than anybody
24:26
else right and in fact i mean
24:29
what wrong one a lot of the uh
24:32
other coins the only way you can buy
24:35
them
24:36
is with bitcoin i mean i believe there
24:37
are even some that you can’t directly
24:40
use fiat currency to buy them you have
24:42
to buy them through
24:44
uh either bitcoin and then there are
24:45
some that you have to you have to use
24:46
ethereum
24:47
but you know it’s it’s there’s you know
24:49
we’re going to talk about the fiat on
24:51
ramp
24:51
there’s a bitcoin on ramp to some of
24:53
these other other coins as well so it
24:55
really
24:55
so really where its value is coming from
24:58
then is the fact that because of early
25:00
adoption and because it was solid
25:02
going on there’s so much
25:05
momentum and there’s so many like you
25:07
said nodes and
25:08
and basically people and firms that are
25:10
using bitcoin and
25:11
building their systems on the bitcoin
25:13
blockchain
25:14
that it’s got that advantage that you
25:17
know it’s it’s sort of like
25:18
if i if i’ve built a uh you know some
25:21
kind of
25:22
business or service that is so well
25:24
established that it’s able to provide
25:26
better than anyone else
25:27
yes i can have other competition and
25:29
they can have market share
25:30
but unless they make a major innovation
25:32
in that space
25:33
i’m going to be the default people go to
25:35
because i was already there i already
25:36
have that that early market adoption
25:39
yeah and it’s also the simplicity right
25:41
so technologically it may not be the
25:43
most advanced but it is the most
25:45
eloquent solution and that’s really what
25:46
draw
25:47
drew me to it right as a cyber security
25:48
professional they use
25:50
the satoshi nakamoto right the you know
25:53
suit anonymous founder of
25:55
bitcoin he or they or she or whatever
25:57
right um
25:58
used a very eloquent solution to secure
26:01
the blockchain right they they use these
26:03
these well-known cybersecurity solutions
26:05
they used well-known
26:07
uh cryptography which is public key and
26:09
private key so you have your private key
26:11
spike
26:12
and that’s how you verify that all your
26:13
transactions are legitimate
26:15
and all those long numbered things that
26:17
you see that are your wallet addresses
26:19
that’s actually a cryptographic key it’s
26:21
called a public key
26:22
you can give that to anyone i was having
26:23
a discussion with a gym owner three days
26:25
ago
26:26
and he’s like can i just send this to
26:27
you and you’ll send me bitcoin i’m like
26:28
yeah man that’s your public
26:30
address it’s literally like if you had
26:31
your street address on the side of the
26:33
road
26:34
someone can walk by and look at it it
26:36
makes no difference it’s just
26:37
identifying where you are in the digital
26:39
world
26:41
so then and this is where i get confused
26:43
so
26:44
my understanding is everyone can view
26:48
because it’s the ledger everyone can and
26:50
we can we’re going to talk a little bit
26:51
more later about you know privacy and
26:52
security issues but like
26:54
okay so if everyone if someone knows my
26:56
wallet that means they can follow
26:58
every single transaction i’ve ever done
27:01
right
27:01
like that that means once they know that
27:03
wallet they can they can follow all the
27:05
other trans or am i or am i incorrect in
27:06
that
27:07
no you’re right um bitcoin has
27:09
integrated some solutions to
27:11
prevent this right with their like
27:13
segregated witness updates
27:15
sedgwit s-e-g-w-i-t um yeah they
27:19
increase the transaction per section and
27:20
they per second and they also
27:22
allowed for the integration of um
27:25
derivative keys
27:26
and so what you have in bitcoin wallets
27:28
that you segwit which
27:29
most do now i think um you can have
27:31
these derived keys and so for every
27:34
transaction you can have a derived key
27:36
that has its own
27:37
um base key basically it’s a it’s a
27:39
cryptographic solution to that issue
27:41
that you’re talking about
27:42
now it’s not completely private but um
27:44
it is it is a
27:45
it is kind of a you know at least a
27:47
cover to you know
27:48
everybody looking at every single
27:49
transaction you’ve ever made so there’s
27:51
still
27:52
there’s still a measure that this
27:53
happened and people can see it but it
27:55
doesn’t give all the details of it
27:56
basically it’s it’s that would only be
27:58
by the actual
27:59
witness of the segregated witnesses that
28:00
were a part of that
28:02
yeah something something like that it’s
28:03
it’s uh the only way you could aggregate
28:06
those transactions is if you had that
28:08
derivative public key
28:09
which is still not not the key you use
28:11
to sign it’s not like your private key
28:12
that everyone has to keep
28:14
private but it is um the the the
28:17
backbone of those other public keys that
28:19
were derived to do
28:20
each one of those independent
28:21
transactions okay okay fair enough
28:24
and so we hear a lot about crypto but
28:27
since
28:27
there are but there are many other
28:29
solutions out there and since especially
28:31
now that bitcoin is dead
28:32
why don’t we talk about some of these
28:33
other programs this other solutions that
28:35
that
28:36
that hopefully won’t die like bitcoin
28:37
did we hear a lot about a lot of things
28:39
like
28:40
i don’t even know if i’m saying it
28:41
correctly defy c5
28:44
um uh data oracles and you know all
28:47
these other blockchain solutions
28:49
what talk to us about what these
28:51
different things mean and and i guess in
28:53
a broader sense talk to us about how
28:55
blockchain can solve a lot of other
28:57
problems that couldn’t
28:58
be previously solved without this type
29:00
of technology
29:02
yeah this is one of the the wildest
29:03
scenarios right it’s where you can go
29:05
full rabbit hole right you can try to
29:07
apply this to
29:09
all kind i mean they’re applying it to
29:11
like insurance products crop protection
29:13
weather analysis like all this stuff but
29:15
anyway so our arbitrating disputes
29:17
there’s yeah
29:18
yeah it’s and inevitably it is better
29:22
right
29:22
there’s less overhead the code is doing
29:24
the work in most of these cases
29:26
if you integrate it appropriately it’s
29:28
trustless so you don’t have to worry
29:29
about right
29:30
someone deciding that they don’t want to
29:32
pay you on the contract anyway so
29:34
so yeah let’s talk about a few of the
29:35
technologies the first thing we need to
29:36
do is establish
29:37
ethereum right so we mentioned ethereum
29:39
here um really ethereum kind of set the
29:41
stage for doing all this other stuff
29:43
right so if bitcoin’s a great store of
29:45
value ethereum
29:47
is how we execute on that store of value
29:49
they call them smart contracts
29:50
you would know these in your real life
29:52
as contracts so they’re really
29:54
not that very not that different right a
29:56
and a contract says what
29:58
if you provide me a service right if
30:00
spike cohen mentions me on his podcast
30:02
i will give him some value right and
30:05
there’s a contract sign that says that
30:06
you will do this
30:07
and you will abide by the contract and
30:09
what does that really mean in the real
30:10
world it means
30:12
you know you’ll do what you say you do
30:13
and if you don’t people will know
30:15
and not use you because you’re not very
30:16
trustworthy right
30:18
in the digital world if we put this into
30:20
code
30:21
then it is immutable that means we can’t
30:24
change it at all
30:25
right and so what ethereum has done has
30:28
a given has given
30:29
a an infrastructure for executing
30:32
contracts
30:33
right and so what you can do is you can
30:35
say hey i want to
30:36
mint my own token for example i want to
30:39
mint travis token
30:40
and there’s going to be 5500 of them and
30:43
i’m going to give them out to special
30:44
people all over the world right and i
30:46
can write that into code
30:47
and have it sit on the ethereum
30:50
blockchain right
30:51
and so those that’s an example of
30:52
something that that you could do
30:54
with ethereum that you cannot do with
30:55
bitcoin right and now people could argue
30:57
there’s some solutions and layer 2 stuff
30:59
and whatever but but that’s that’s the
31:00
essential
31:01
transition ethereum actually has that
31:03
built into its system as opposed to
31:06
retrofitting it onto onto bitcoin yeah
31:08
with its coding language salinity
31:10
yeah they built this language
31:11
infrastructure to do just that
31:13
right right okay cool uh go ahead go
31:16
ahead yeah so so let’s get to your your
31:18
c5d5 stuff right yeah
31:20
so yeah our c5d5 stuff we’re in this
31:22
together spike
31:23
so so this is our d5
31:27
comrade yeah so actually it’s
31:30
it’s more eloquent than that because we
31:32
really are right if we’re participating
31:33
in this infrastructure
31:35
we are verifying the blocks we are we
31:37
are uh
31:38
building our infrastructure out right
31:39
now right it’s in its
31:41
infancy it’s in its internet 1993 days
31:43
which is the coolest thing
31:45
so so then if we can do these things
31:48
if we can allow for the creation of
31:51
tokens the transaction of tokens with
31:53
some dynamic
31:54
changes right if the price hits this
31:56
value i will send it into this location
31:58
right those are those are contract
32:00
uh qualifiers basically so if i start
32:02
doing that then i can start building in
32:04
logic so let’s let’s talk about what
32:05
what logic i might build in how about i
32:07
build a piece of code
32:09
that allows me to swap tokens right it’s
32:12
just code that if i put some
32:14
tokens in there’s a a pool of tokens
32:16
that it
32:17
that it can draw from called a liquidity
32:19
pool and it will give me some other
32:21
tokens out right
32:22
i put in for example i put in dollars
32:24
and get out euros in like the real world
32:26
right
32:26
okay so i i uh i put in
32:30
chain link and i get out ethereum ether
32:32
tokens right
32:33
and that’s called decentralized finance
32:35
d5 right that’s
32:36
a code base that is executing that for
32:39
you and there’s all these really cool
32:40
things that they do
32:41
around d5 to incentivize you to
32:43
participate right
32:44
because you need tokens just like just
32:47
like a bank or an
32:48
exchange like the nasdaq right or these
32:51
stock exchanges or whoever provides the
32:53
liquidity to the stock market i know
32:54
more about
32:55
cryptocurrency than i do about the stock
32:56
market by the way right right right um
32:59
you need people to participate in these
33:00
infrastructures right you need them to
33:02
lend you their tokens so that you can
33:03
swap them out and do these things right
33:05
and so you need them you need to put
33:07
them in the protocol which is this weird
33:09
ephemeral space
33:10
that the that the code is using right
33:13
that’s decentralized finance okay so we
33:15
talked about
33:15
what it is why is it so great right if
33:18
this is another example of a trustless
33:20
environment
33:20
right i don’t have to worry about you
33:22
know robin hood not being not allowing
33:24
me to trade something
33:26
i don’t have to worry about whether the
33:27
stock market is open on monday
33:29
right or on saturday or on friday or on
33:31
president’s day or on july 4th
33:33
right i don’t have to worry about any of
33:34
these things or a 2 or a two
33:37
or a 2 40 in the morning or something
33:38
like that yeah yeah yeah
33:40
the protocol executes and it does it
33:43
with
33:43
precision and it is immutable when you
33:46
ask it to do something it does it in the
33:48
exact way it was designed to
33:50
now we have to be concerned with the the
33:52
quality of this code right
33:53
so we do things like you know code
33:55
review and regular code review and
33:57
audits and all these things
33:58
but i mean that’s the cool part about d5
34:00
right is this decentralized mechanism
34:03
and there’s this like halfway in between
34:05
infrastructure that they have out there
34:06
now called c5
34:08
centralized finance but in the
34:10
cryptocurrency world and there are a
34:11
couple of solutions out there
34:13
celsius blockchain block fi um
34:16
some of your exchanges coinbase and
34:18
kraken and
34:20
gemini they do some of this c5 stuff too
34:23
they’ll do centralized finance right
34:25
which is allowing you to exchange tokens
34:26
it’s allowing you to earn interest for
34:28
example like what your bank does on your
34:30
on your coins so you can do that in a
34:31
centralized manner or in a decentralized
34:34
manner now you have the option right
34:35
before you just put your money in a bank
34:37
and that liquidity pool of money got
34:40
exchanged and moved around and earned
34:41
interest and did all these things with
34:43
basically without your knowledge at this
34:44
point so what’s
34:46
it so then that explains i’m you know
34:48
i’m being told you know uh
34:49
ethereum 2.0 that i can stake my my
34:52
uh ether tokens uh into uh
34:56
into ethereum for a like a seven and a
34:58
half percent
34:59
uh return on inve annual return on
35:01
investment is that they want me to stake
35:03
it because they need to have that
35:04
that in that space that that ephemeral
35:07
space that you were talking about
35:08
uh where they can use that
35:11
to basically that’s the part i’m not
35:14
getting so
35:14
they need my coins so that they because
35:16
they’re they’re rebuilding
35:18
the infrastructure of it and they need
35:20
the coins to be able to do that that
35:22
that’s the part that that’s where i stop
35:24
that’s where my three to five minutes of
35:26
talking intelligently cuts off and i and
35:28
i let someone else answer it so you said
35:29
we were going to tell people no on this
35:31
podcast i’m going to tell you no spike
35:33
okay okay no good good good yeah so
35:35
that’s so
35:36
so that’s actually a different mechanism
35:37
right so defy
35:39
is this layer on ethereum that does that
35:41
type of stuff
35:42
ethereum staking is actually a different
35:44
mechanism but it’s
35:46
it’s rewarding you for doing something
35:47
but not that right what it’s supporting
35:49
you for doing is participating in the
35:51
ethereum network
35:52
so where bitcoin rewards you for mining
35:55
and expending your cpu power to try and
35:57
solve these problems to secure the
35:59
network right
36:00
the ethereum is moving towards rewarding
36:02
use differently
36:03
it’s called proof of stake so what
36:05
bitcoin does is proof of work you do the
36:06
work
36:07
and eventually if you do enough work
36:08
i’ll give you a bitcoin right
36:10
in ethereum it’s they’re moving to proof
36:13
of stake and so what proof of stake is
36:15
is you participate in the network and
36:17
then
36:18
by participating and staking some of
36:20
your value in the network
36:22
they might reward you right and so it’s
36:24
the same it’s the same mechanism of
36:26
proof of work but instead of just doing
36:27
work over and over
36:28
you actually just hold your value with
36:30
them and then randomly
36:31
they select a node every so often and
36:34
some of that value is awarded to that
36:36
node for just participating in the in
36:38
the
36:39
infrastructure so then how does
36:42
how is the work done if they’re not
36:43
rewarding the work and they’re just
36:44
rewarding the
36:45
having the skin in the game how is the
36:46
work done very good so
36:48
it’s uh so the work isn’t necessary
36:51
right so
36:52
the the stake is so the what the work
36:54
does
36:55
is it decentralizes everything it allows
36:58
everyone to participate that’s all it is
36:59
it’s a mechanism to allow everyone to
37:01
participate
37:02
and to increase the block every time you
37:04
need more transactions add ledger
37:05
entries to those transactions right
37:06
right right right
37:08
and so this and so the work acts as a
37:10
proxy to let you participate right
37:12
so how else could you participate you
37:13
could own ether right and you could
37:15
stake it in the ethereum protocol
37:17
and you could then participate in the
37:19
ethereum network instead of having to
37:20
use
37:21
computational mining right uh what what
37:23
the ethereum trust believes right is
37:26
that it’s a more
37:27
equitable distribution of tokens because
37:29
you don’t have to have these huge
37:30
bitcoin mining farms
37:32
now you can literally just hold any
37:33
amount of ethereum and
37:36
and add it to the protocol to
37:37
participate in that decentralized
37:39
infrastructure
37:40
and then that they will reward you for
37:42
that participation
37:44
and there’s no work that’s having to be
37:46
done so who susses out the the
37:48
the ledger and verifies that the
37:50
transactions are correct and all that
37:51
yeah so you still have you still have um
37:54
like
37:55
no you still have people participating
37:57
in the the le the block distribution
37:59
right okay so those so so you get
38:01
rewarded for participating in ethereum
38:03
with proof of stake and you also get
38:05
rewarded for um uh the transaction
38:08
the the value of the transactions right
38:11
okay so it’s not called proof of
38:13
okay okay so there is still a it’s not
38:15
called proof of work but there is still
38:16
a reward for uh for actually building
38:20
out the ledger
38:21
and and and making sure that the
38:23
transaction yeah okay okay
38:24
all right but yeah okay no that makes
38:27
sense no
38:28
that was the thing that because i knew
38:29
that people were saying oh well these
38:31
ones are much more efficient because
38:32
they don’t require proof of work and i’m
38:34
like
38:35
okay well then who’s doing the work so
38:36
okay that makes sense that makes sense
38:37
so you’re generating the blocks you’re
38:38
just not doing all of that
38:40
that mechanism to make your the
38:42
decentralization work right all you’re
38:44
doing is the work to make the blocks
38:46
which is very simple
38:47
right you and the way you’re
38:48
participating in the decentralized
38:49
network is by owning ethereum
38:51
instead of having to do all of the work
38:53
so there’s a small amount of work that’s
38:54
done now
38:55
okay so instead of the entire network
38:58
having to participate in order to keep
38:59
it decentralized these things are being
39:01
built out by those who
39:02
who are are building it out or or or
39:05
being uh vet vetted and processed but
39:08
then the
39:09
decentralization is the fact that
39:10
they’re rewarding you for owning any to
39:12
begin with
39:13
yes and and actively participating by
39:15
staking in that protocol
39:17
okay all right okay now that makes sense
39:20
to me
39:20
so that was my that was part that was 30
39:23
percent of my reason for having you on
39:24
was was to explain
39:26
that it’s weird stuff so um
39:29
so these and let’s talk a little bit
39:32
about coins versus tokens because
39:34
i i just uh a couple weeks ago uh
39:38
uh figure found out what the difference
39:40
was um i thought i knew it but now i
39:43
i get it and it was explained to me in a
39:45
very intuitive way which i’m sure is how
39:46
you’re about to do it
39:47
what is the difference between coins and
39:49
tokens
39:50
yeah so coins are rewards for blockchain
39:54
participants
39:55
so a bitcoin coin an ether
39:58
coin right a cardano ada coin those are
40:01
all block chains
40:02
they are actual chains of ledgers that
40:05
are used
40:05
as networks for this ledger
40:07
infrastructure we were talking about
40:08
those are coins okay okay tokens
40:11
tokens are uh they are
40:14
rewa they are value for let’s say
40:18
smart contracts built on top of these
40:20
solutions they are layer we call them
40:22
layer two
40:23
right so coins are layer one they are
40:25
the base layer
40:26
and tokens are layer two right they are
40:29
an overlay
40:30
on someone else’s block chain and so
40:34
we call them in uh in ethereum there are
40:36
a few different variations but the most
40:37
common token is an erc
40:39
20 token and so that token is a part as
40:42
a as an ethereum smart contract
40:44
infrastructure right
40:45
and so you write a contract that says
40:47
i’m going to mint 5000 travis tokens
40:49
right and they can do different things
40:51
but the but the minting process is just
40:53
the first part right
40:54
and then those tokens live and exchange
40:57
on
40:57
the the ethereum backbone so
41:02
using a an example that others might
41:05
be so so the coin is basically the
41:08
the coin that’s actually the official
41:10
currency of that blockchain basically
41:12
and then the tokens are things built on
41:13
top of that either for a specific use
41:16
or a certain environment that’s been
41:17
created or something so like a real
41:19
world example although
41:20
i shouldn’t say real world because i
41:21
mean bitcoin you know having died is now
41:24
very real world there are people that
41:25
you know they
41:26
their their fortune of bitcoin is now
41:28
down to
41:29
50 more than 50 000 times what a us
41:32
dollar is and you know
41:33
rest in peace to them thoughts and
41:34
prayers but the the
41:36
uh the the coin uh so using a i guess
41:40
real world or in real life example
41:42
uh so we have dollars that’s the that
41:44
would be the coin
41:45
uh that’s the money in the currency but
41:48
then like for example
41:49
you go into a chuck e cheese and you
41:51
exchange it for tokens that you can use
41:53
uh in the machines or you go and play uh
41:56
world of warcraft world of warcraft or
41:58
some other game like that
41:59
and you’re exchanging it for whatever
42:00
the currency is in that that’s sort it’s
42:02
not a perfect
42:03
parallel or anything like that but it’s
42:05
a similar it’s kind of a decent analogy
42:07
for
42:08
what is the coin and what is the token
42:10
right yeah or
42:11
or you buy tesla right tesla is
42:13
denominated in dollars you needed those
42:15
dollars to get that
42:16
to get that tesla stock they they do
42:18
everything in oh the stock yeah
42:20
right they do everything in the us
42:22
dollar base that layer they buy all
42:24
their commodity goods they transact all
42:25
their value in u.s dollars right
42:27
but they’re still represented a
42:28
representation of that company
42:30
right and they’re using the it’s not a
42:33
blockchain but they’re using the
42:35
financial
42:36
infrastructure of the dollar or whatever
42:38
that you
42:39
whatever you were using to to buy them
42:40
okay cool all right
42:42
transactional yeah using a dollar
42:45
transactional layer yeah it’s just it’s
42:47
a crappy one that loses value over time
42:49
and it’s
42:49
highly centralized and they print out
42:51
more whenever they want to but
42:53
it’s it’s uh you know it’s it’s similar
42:55
similar parallels there so
42:57
um it’s obvious that everything that
42:59
we’re talking about
43:00
naturally serves and has an effect on
43:03
decentralizing things
43:05
which makes sense that so many
43:06
libertarians
43:08
anarchists people that are
43:10
decentralization
43:11
or or the term on the left might be
43:14
democratization but it’s essentially the
43:16
same thing
43:16
it takes the power and responsibility
43:19
out of the hands of a small handful of
43:21
people who created
43:22
a top-down system and it decentralizes
43:25
it out
43:26
to literally all of us so that obviously
43:29
has
43:30
an effect of decentralizing everything
43:32
eventually away from top-down systems
43:34
towards
43:35
more cooperative and competitive
43:37
decentralized ones
43:38
uh on everything like you said
43:40
blockchain can be applied to so many
43:42
things which
43:43
as a libertarian as someone who is an
43:45
anarchist and who is more
43:46
you know decentralized leaning who is
43:48
about you know
43:49
dismantling and decentralizing power out
43:52
to everyone
43:53
uh leading to often fairer and more
43:55
equitable and and
43:56
and freer solutions what effect that
43:59
do you think that this will have on like
44:01
the existing structure
44:03
like what effect will this have on on
44:05
government what effect will this have on
44:07
big business how does that look to you
44:09
so i think the analog is the internet
44:11
right the internet democratized data
44:13
for everybody right before you had to go
44:16
to a university you had to
44:18
have access to a library which not
44:20
everybody does in third world countries
44:22
all of these things have the time to do
44:24
it
44:24
now you can stream all the stuff to your
44:25
phone so so if you if you think about
44:27
the analog
44:28
to data democratization right and then
44:30
you scale it up by like
44:32
a thousand times in my opinion right
44:34
because right data is
44:36
important right but transacting value is
44:38
everything
44:41
so that’s the that’s the real scary part
44:43
in my opinion or the real cool part is
44:45
so what i think the what i think the net
44:47
effect is is very similar to the
44:49
democratization
44:50
of data right you’re going to get more
44:51
participation in the infrastructure more
44:53
participation
44:54
not in the cyber security infrastructure
44:55
or the cryptographic infrastructure but
44:57
in the world infrastructure
44:59
in the world economy right you’re going
45:00
to have more value transaction from
45:02
different places
45:03
you’re going to have more more access to
45:06
capital for people in venezuela or
45:09
argentina or nigeria or in
45:11
other places here in the u.s right well
45:13
like the
45:14
the access to this infrastructure is now
45:17
unlimited
45:18
whereas before if you were denominated
45:20
in venezuelan pesos right
45:22
or in venezuelan boulevard pesos or in
45:25
venezuela bolivar or in lira or
45:28
something like that in lebanon
45:29
right this is this it would be scary
45:31
stuff and now you don’t know how to get
45:33
paid because when the dollars come into
45:35
your country
45:36
they are 40 scalped by the lebanese
45:38
government because
45:39
they they are trying to keep the peg
45:41
appropriate and all these things so
45:43
it’s going to democratize all of this
45:44
value in my opinion
45:46
so you know this is a subject that
45:48
because you know i
45:49
i say to people pretty similar to how
45:52
you’ve said it
45:53
this is the internetization of all
45:55
things
45:56
at largely at once it’s not like it’s
45:59
going to happen immediately but
46:00
this opens up
46:03
everything to being decentralized
46:07
whether anyone likes it or not because
46:09
that’s just naturally how things are
46:10
going to go using these systems which
46:12
are
46:13
exponentially more efficient for those
46:16
who know me they know that i am a
46:17
stickler about the use of
46:18
use of the term exponentially it doesn’t
46:20
just mean multiply so it means that
46:23
there are actual you i can add or remove
46:25
zeros
46:26
by by a matter of actual exponents this
46:28
is
46:29
exponentially more efficient and and
46:32
therefore desirable
46:33
than any other system so it will in the
46:35
same way
46:36
that the internet has easily replaced
46:39
uh you know uh uh telegraphs
46:42
and and and fax machines
46:45
and um you know snail mail where those
46:48
things are really
46:49
just you know novelties that we use
46:52
right now if you write a letter to
46:53
someone it’s to show them how important
46:55
they are to you it’s not because that’s
46:56
how you actually
46:57
have to reach someone uh you know it’s
46:59
it’s it’s the
47:00
the our telephones are largely
47:02
increasingly just the internet
47:04
but with voice um it has completely the
47:07
but that was just
47:08
the way that we interact with each other
47:12
this is everything so when for example
47:14
i’ll say to someone you know this is
47:16
like the internet
47:17
internetization of everything they go oh
47:20
great so everything’s gonna be
47:22
in in control of big tech and it’s like
47:24
actually no
47:25
because we are still far more
47:28
decentralized in the way that we
47:29
communicate and receive information
47:31
than we were prior to it it did
47:33
centralize together
47:35
and has been centralizing together
47:36
somewhat in social media
47:38
by a handful of tech companies because
47:40
of the fact that everything else is
47:41
still
47:42
centralized this decentralizes all that
47:45
stuff too
47:46
so now a bunch of people working
47:48
together on one of these blockchain
47:50
systems
47:51
can create a facebook or something
47:53
similar to it
47:56
far more easily than a centralized
47:58
company with a top-down
48:00
hierarchical corporate infrastructure
48:02
which was really only created for tax
48:04
purposes and legal purposes
48:06
they can create something that actually
48:08
is more efficient and was created for
48:10
that
48:10
effectiveness and efficiency that’ll be
48:12
far better than facebook that’ll be far
48:14
better which is why i’m less worried
48:16
about big tech right now
48:18
because the nature of of of the very the
48:21
very nature of
48:22
blockchain is the total decentralization
48:25
of all things
48:26
uh with really and then as the power
48:29
industry becomes more and more
48:30
decentralized with things like and
48:32
now i’m going off into a total total
48:34
tangent with things like
48:35
micro reactors you know with thorium i’m
48:38
going way into a whole thing but
48:40
as life and society gets more and more
48:42
decentralized
48:45
the justification or reason for
48:47
existence of these major systems
48:50
that you know give us the scraps of what
48:52
they determine that we’re allowed to
48:53
have and i’m even talking about
48:55
governments here
48:56
not only do they not become prime
48:58
anymore
48:59
not only are they not in control anymore
49:01
there’s no real argument for them to
49:03
exist anymore i don’t know if you
49:04
consider yourself an anarchist or not
49:05
but
49:06
is there in the midst of this what will
49:08
even be the argument for
49:10
continued centralization of anything or
49:12
will there be
49:14
yeah it really makes you think a lot
49:15
about you know what
49:17
money means to you and these types of
49:19
things right
49:21
it’s it’s it’s really it’s almost scary
49:22
right you come for everybody says you
49:24
come for the price appreciation
49:25
and you stay for all the other stuff
49:27
right you’re like oh look at bitcoin
49:29
price go up all this stuff just over
49:30
time most
49:31
appreciating asset of all asset class of
49:33
all time in the last 12 years right
49:35
but when you start thinking about how
49:37
your money works right
49:38
how your government interacts with your
49:40
money how you interact with your money
49:42
and your government and that it’s really
49:44
just a store of value of your time
49:46
elon musk said this great like an
49:47
interview he’s like money is just a
49:49
proxy
49:49
for the value and time that you that you
49:51
accrue right
49:52
right um it’s a store of value that you
49:56
can then use
49:57
uh for for for some other thing that you
49:59
find more valuable than what you’re
50:00
exchanging it for
50:02
i want to go back to that swallowing
50:03
stuff right my favorite analog to this
50:06
where people
50:06
people really have a hard time
50:08
understanding like how technology
50:10
swallows things right we just see the
50:11
internet some 1990s boom and then all of
50:13
a sudden boom here we are
50:15
right streaming video over the internet
50:17
to everybody
50:18
at all everywhere 80 million platforms
50:20
right yes
50:21
right and everyone just thinks it’s
50:22
normal but from my guest room
50:25
yeah if you go back and you look at what
50:28
the internet did
50:29
right the internet ran over the phones
50:32
the phone
50:32
infrastructure those people controlled
50:35
the access to the internet at one point
50:37
you’re the the phone companies at t
50:39
right
50:40
and now what happens we’re running over
50:42
the internet the phones the
50:44
communication runs over the internet the
50:46
internet
50:46
swallowed all that stuff the internet
50:48
said oh you think you do communication
50:50
well
50:50
well we do it better we can stream it
50:52
live to anybody we can
50:54
we can democratize access we can
50:55
restrict access if we don’t want people
50:57
in this room here with us
50:58
we can do whatever we want to do we can
51:00
overlay music
51:02
and video and my title and whatever else
51:05
right yeah okay so bitcoin being dead
51:09
the internet swallowed the phones yeah
51:11
well what happens when
51:13
the cryptocurrency the store of value
51:16
swallows your store of value the dollar
51:19
the banks
51:20
the infrastructure to transact uh
51:22
internationally sepa and ach
51:24
and the clearing is instant and the
51:26
value transfer is undeniable and
51:28
immutable
51:28
what happens when all these things start
51:30
start to really get built out right
51:33
and the early adopters are going to be
51:34
rewarded for that just like they were in
51:36
in the internet and just like that
51:38
you’re seeing now with bitcoin being
51:40
dead
51:40
and being rewarded being being rewarded
51:43
for its death the
51:44
the phoenix rising from the ashes no
51:46
it’s like you and i love that that
51:48
example
51:49
you know the internet used to be used i
51:51
i’m old
51:52
how uh out of here how old are you i’m
51:54
33.
51:55
okay so yeah okay so i’m a few years old
51:57
you do you remember the age of having to
51:59
use dial up internet
52:01
oh yeah okay okay cool cool cool so i
52:03
was yeah i was like
52:04
you know when i was 13 14 i’m having to
52:06
use the internet
52:10
you were having to you which is why it
52:11
was so restricted
52:13
because it was basically what your what
52:15
your phone provider could could give you
52:17
however many kilobytes per second or
52:19
whatever which is just hilarious now
52:20
because we’re using like
52:22
a base of 5000 kilobytes a second just
52:24
to stream this
52:25
uh not to mention everything else
52:27
happening above it but
52:29
this is the reason we even are still
52:31
using the phone is because the idea of
52:33
calling someone and speaking with them
52:35
is still useful
52:36
centralized systems of finance are not
52:40
useful
52:41
when they’re replaced with something
52:42
that you know so it’s not i don’t know
52:44
that
52:45
the dollar will necessarily be run over
52:48
blockchain as much as it just won’t
52:51
there won’t be a need for it anymore if
52:53
there’s
52:53
if there’s a store of value that is
52:56
exponentially
52:57
more efficient and faster and more
52:59
trustworthy
53:00
and less prone to abuse and can’t be
53:02
printed out endlessly by a government
53:04
uh to to deride your to diminish the
53:08
value of what you’re holding
53:09
there’s is there even a reason for that
53:11
to exist anymore
53:14
yeah i i don’t know i’m a
53:17
i i i struggle with that question now
53:20
right
53:21
more than i did 36 months ago which is
53:24
the weird thing why
53:25
why would we not think about this until
53:27
it became a mainstream idea that we
53:28
could decentralize this value
53:30
infrastructure right
53:31
yeah it’s weird too because our
53:33
understanding of how technology evolves
53:35
is really it’s really muted it’s very
53:37
difficult to see the future
53:39
for example right people get rewarded
53:40
for that your elon musks
53:42
your jeff bezos is your you know
53:45
they get rewarded for seeing those
53:46
things to seek the pattern and see how
53:48
it’s going to work in the future
53:49
yeah yeah they see it coming and and
53:52
bezos for all his insight was
53:53
way too early right amazon’s price
53:55
depreciated by like 95
53:57
right yeah he saw it and we didn’t have
53:59
the technology to build what he wanted
54:01
to do wasn’t ready yet exactly
54:03
he’s like we’re gonna do it we’ll be
54:04
there right and that’s where we are now
54:06
right i i’m over here ranting like a
54:09
maniac on a live stream about how we’re
54:11
gonna swallow everything
54:13
and how i’m gonna pay a developer in
54:15
nigeria the exact same value and i’m
54:17
gonna pay him
54:17
on every hour that he works every hour
54:19
that he does because
54:21
that’s how easy this value transaction
54:23
is and everyone’s going
54:24
that doesn’t even compute right exactly
54:27
and eventually you’re going to see this
54:28
jack muller the guy who is developing a
54:30
layer 2 solution on bitcoin
54:32
was paying one of his developers every
54:33
second he showed this on a live stream
54:36
tweet he was like look
54:37
and he set up he set up a a code base
54:39
that would do that
54:40
it would stream bitcoin to him every
54:41
second he said here you go this is all
54:43
the value you have to me and i’m gonna
54:44
give it to you every second
54:45
i’m gonna give you an increment of that
54:47
of your salary and so now you have it
54:49
there’s no transaction every two weeks
54:51
why not if the if the transactional cost
54:53
is zero
54:54
then why can’t i just give it to you
54:55
every second every five minutes every
54:57
hour who cares
54:58
and what happens when you’re using ai
55:00
and you’re paying someone’s ai system in
55:02
in nano seconds like
55:04
it’s incredible what’s going to happen
55:05
so anyway before
55:07
we’re very wide-eyed and going down a
55:08
rabbit hole here but i think we’ve
55:10
touched on the basics here that
55:12
everything’s going to change and it’s
55:14
going to be amazing if you find yourself
55:16
having very little power in this system
55:18
that we have right now
55:19
the less power you have in my mind and
55:22
you can tell me if you disagree in my
55:23
mind
55:24
you’re gonna be happy or you should be
55:26
happier
55:27
than those who have a lot of power and
55:29
wealth built into the system
55:31
who suddenly will have no real reason to
55:33
exist but anyway
55:35
all that aside there are many questions
55:37
that i can sum up into two questions
55:39
here
55:40
number one what do you think about
55:42
dogecoin
55:43
like what do like i think it’s a meme
55:45
but yet i’m still gonna buy a hundred
55:47
bucks worth
55:48
because just in case it be replaces the
55:50
entire world financial system
55:52
i want to get in what what do you think
55:54
of dogecoin specifically okay so
55:56
so i believe everybody when they say
55:58
dogecoin is a meme coin
55:59
right it has no inherent value but it is
56:02
very interesting in the fact that
56:03
it is representative of sentiment right
56:06
and so
56:06
uh personally i don’t hold any dogecoin
56:10
and when people bring it up with me i
56:11
laugh right because uh all of the things
56:13
that i’m interested in
56:15
uh have inherent value right they
56:17
generate value and they do things right
56:19
bitcoin ethereum some of these other
56:21
there are a couple other tokens that i’m
56:23
very very interested in they have
56:24
inherent value and the use case for that
56:27
token
56:27
is clear too right they call it
56:29
tokenomics what does this thing do
56:31
why do i need a token you ask why we
56:33
need dollars right well why do i need a
56:35
token too
56:36
right so if it doesn’t have a use case
56:38
for me it’s not really in my
56:40
you know if you want my honest opinion
56:41
it doesn’t have a ton of value to me
56:43
um but i i love that it’s a gauge of
56:45
sentiment that i do find
56:46
absolutely fascinating it is definitely
56:48
a gauge of sentiment
56:50
and it is definitely i’m getting 100 i’m
56:52
getting 100 bucks worth because if the
56:53
worst case scenario i lose 100 bucks
56:54
best case scenario
56:56
i i gain 100 bucks well actually no best
56:58
case scenarios so
56:59
i get i get 100 i get i become a
57:01
millionaire i i just think the whole
57:03
thing is hilarious
57:04
you know i shared how the the people on
57:06
reddit actually made sure that it traded
57:09
so that the candles stick of it traced
57:12
the actual ears of the doge like i mean
57:15
it’s a meme like it’s it’s literally
57:17
it’s a me they’re having fun with it and
57:19
it’s a meme
57:20
it is what it is anyway uh uh but i i’m
57:23
gonna i
57:24
i you know people people people are now
57:26
saying you should buy these other coins
57:28
instead
57:28
folks i i used to have crypto i lost all
57:31
of it in a very tragic computing
57:33
accident and it’s very
57:34
very sad i don’t have any crypto anymore
57:36
um so uh
57:37
uh um i’ve confused my guests with my
57:40
boating
57:41
uh accident reference um but anyway uh
57:45
the other question is you know uh steve
57:48
south asked a few you know
57:49
and a few other people asked as well you
57:51
know what happens
57:53
if governments say
57:57
all crypto is banned except for ours and
57:59
you have to use ours
58:02
it’s kind of too late for them to stop
58:04
it isn’t it or am i wrong
58:07
no you’re absolutely right again in my
58:08
opinion right and there’s two there’s
58:10
two real
58:11
real bear cases for bitcoin right one is
58:13
governmental intervention right
58:15
and so let’s well you take the use case
58:17
right so nigeria is trying to ban
58:19
bitcoin right and what have they seen an
58:21
uptick in peer-to-peer bitcoin
58:23
transactions
58:24
right what are you gonna what are you
58:26
gonna do it’s clear
58:27
at that point right that government and
58:29
regulators don’t understand
58:30
what the fundamentals of bitcoin are
58:32
right right also
58:34
try and confiscate their bitcoin right
58:35
they’ve tried to do this with
58:37
criminals and these types of things it’s
58:38
happened over the last couple of months
58:40
specifically there have been specific
58:41
examples where they’re like
58:42
i don’t know i don’t have my private key
58:44
forgot it not giving it to you
58:45
what are you gonna do sorry yeah
58:50
the the second case is and i’ve heard
58:52
this from a few uh a few friends and
58:54
pundits
58:55
right is uh what happens if the internet
58:57
goes away right
58:58
so well what happens if i can’t and it’s
59:00
like if the internet goes away
59:02
we’ve got way more problems than you not
59:04
being able to get your bitcoin
59:05
yeah yeah if the internet so basically
59:09
the only way the internet is going away
59:11
is if the electrical grid is going away
59:14
long term i don’t just mean yeah i don’t
59:17
mean just
59:18
you know a short and by the way you know
59:20
my greatest
59:22
prayers and and and thought seriously to
59:24
the people in texas in oklahoma
59:25
i i’ve been here in myrtle beach where
59:27
we’ve lost where we’ve lost power and
59:28
had
59:29
you know tons of snow for a few days
59:31
it’s not fun
59:32
you know guys stay strong and stay safe
59:34
and and if you’re i mean i i love that
59:36
you’re on here but if you’re using what
59:38
little
59:38
you know power you have on your phone to
59:40
watch this maybe well and i don’t want
59:42
to tell you not to watch but
59:43
you know i but but you know long term
59:46
you know we don’t have an internet
59:47
anymore
59:48
because we have lost everything dollars
59:51
are worthless
59:52
uh you know in that case euro are
59:54
worthless whatever your your mutual
59:56
funds are worthless
59:58
your car is worthless like after a
60:00
certain point because once it goes down
60:02
then no one’s gonna be able to fix it
60:03
and you know you’re uh you know
60:06
you sh i’m not even sure you should be
60:07
buying silver and gold you should
60:08
probably be buying like bullets and food
60:10
like
60:10
you know that the if if if we’re going
60:13
in that direction
60:14
it’s going to be like a like a mad
60:17
it’s not even mad max i mean it it would
60:19
be like you know going back to the stone
60:22
age
60:22
inside of a generation because most of
60:24
us don’t know how to live that way so
60:26
it would be a mass culling of the vast
60:28
majority of us
60:29
uh that you know can’t live off off the
60:32
earth
60:33
and uh and you know it it bitcoin is
60:35
going to be the least of our troubles
60:37
but at that like
60:38
your everything you have is worthless
60:39
except for your guns your bullets and
60:41
and any any uh non-perishable food items
60:44
you have
60:45
pretty pretty much my cyber security
60:47
job’s gonna be null and void
60:48
yes you will have to find a new job and
60:51
you won’t have a monster.com to go to
60:53
to try to find your next job you’ll be
60:55
screwed in every way in every major way
60:56
also good luck getting food
60:58
but uh yeah so um i i tend to agree with
61:02
you i think i think it’s
61:03
it is far too late for governments
61:06
to try to stop this and in fact if they
61:08
try to stop it it’s just going to push
61:10
people into it even more
61:11
it’s sort of like when you say to
61:13
someone hey it’s either me
61:15
or him and it turns out they like him
61:17
even more
61:18
and so now it just marginalizes me i
61:20
lose my friend in it
61:22
as an example so um now there are some
61:26
current limitations uh to the blockchain
61:28
and to crypto
61:29
uh such as the number of transactions
61:31
that can be carried out every second
61:33
uh network usage fees that are that are
61:36
built in although they’re much less than
61:37
the
61:38
usage fees of competing centralized
61:40
systems but they are there
61:42
um the fact that you have to fiat uh on
61:44
there you have to use a fiat on ramp at
61:46
least for now
61:47
uh which are basically the exchanges
61:48
that we use to exchange fiat currency
61:50
for crypto
61:51
talk to us about these types of
61:52
limitations what they are and
61:54
what things that are being done to to
61:56
innovate past these these limitations
61:59
yeah so from a technology standpoint
62:01
people really harp on
62:02
uh the transactions per second of the
62:04
bitcoin network
62:06
and so when the bitcoin network gets
62:07
congested especially in
62:10
really high volatility times like we’re
62:11
seeing now with like exponential price
62:13
increases and things like this
62:15
what you see is the bitcoin network does
62:17
get congested
62:18
and the the time it takes for you to
62:20
transact that value
62:21
goes from minutes to 15 minutes to one
62:25
hour to two hours in some cases in like
62:27
the 2017 bull run
62:29
and that is you know to to to a
62:31
technology that hangs its hat on
62:33
being immutable and quick right that’s a
62:35
scary component
62:36
and so there are you know bitcoin the
62:39
bitcoin
62:40
funds out there that are that are
62:42
contributing to the open source
62:43
development are working on these things
62:45
they’re working on some layer two
62:46
scaling solutions like lightning network
62:48
it is being built out and again you
62:50
pointed this out right
62:51
if uh if an if you know the disadvantage
62:54
is a 15-minute transaction
62:55
is what you’re complaining about then
62:57
the centralized banking system clearing
62:59
in three weeks
63:00
should be uh appalling to you right
63:04
the second one well and i was just gonna
63:07
say and just in the same way as your
63:09
banks will often cover that while it’s
63:11
being cleared
63:12
there are systems being created that
63:14
will cover these things
63:15
for that 15 minutes that it’s being
63:17
cleared which is sort of like what the
63:19
lightning network is right like it’s
63:20
sort of pre-clearing it before
63:22
the actual clearing happens man i need
63:24
to do more research on the lightning
63:25
network
63:26
uh okay okay okay it’s a really
63:29
interesting technology
63:30
and i know it’s a really slick layer to
63:32
scaling technology
63:33
but i haven’t done a tech deep dive um i
63:36
yeah
63:36
it’s it’s really interesting okay that’s
63:38
fair but but the second point is uh
63:41
the network fees yeah yeah and so
63:42
network fees are a huge problem though
63:44
actually in my opinion probably the
63:46
biggest attractor to the ethereum
63:47
network is
63:48
uh the network fees and that’s what
63:50
ethereum 2.0 is
63:51
in part trying to solve they went to
63:53
proof of they’re going to proof of stake
63:55
um to solve some of the central
63:58
centrality i suppose of ethereum mining
64:00
um and it doesn’t do as good a job at
64:02
you know working off the network fees
64:04
but i mean
64:04
the ethereum transaction fees are
64:06
astronomical right now
64:08
and they really are a barrier to entry
64:09
for um the little guy which is a weird
64:11
thing to say
64:12
in in you know blockchain and
64:14
decentralized infrastructures
64:16
i mean you could have transaction fees
64:18
for any for any type of transaction
64:19
small or large
64:20
uh up to you know 50 60 100 on the on
64:24
the
64:24
ethereum network right now so let’s say
64:26
you wanted to exchange your is that is
64:28
that
64:28
is that a is that a base fee or or a
64:31
percentage of the
64:32
of the amount so it’s it’s a combination
64:34
of both yeah so
64:35
as you try to transact as you transact
64:37
more coins
64:38
than the then the mechanism of
64:40
transaction increases so you do have
64:42
a larger fee for lar for slightly larger
64:46
transactions
64:46
but realistically there’s kind of some
64:48
minimum threshold that’s that gets to
64:50
that
64:50
is large and then it’s a little bit more
64:52
on top of that
64:54
so but i mean yeah i mean if you’re
64:56
trying to buy
64:57
you know if you have some ether for
64:59
example and you’re trying to get you
65:00
know one of these tokens
65:02
a celsius or a chain link these are just
65:05
two erc20s i have on the top of my head
65:06
if you’re trying to get some of those
65:08
projects you know and you want to buy a
65:10
hundred dollars worth like of your
65:12
dogecoin
65:12
you know um it’s gonna cost you like
65:15
right now when
65:16
everything is you know the opposite of
65:19
dying
65:19
right it’s you know and people want to
65:21
be on the network right
65:22
it’s going to be really expensive and
65:24
and that’s and that’s a real
65:26
that’s a real issue and you see you
65:27
actually see the technologies the open
65:30
market right
65:31
driving adoption in other technologies
65:33
right what has happened to some of these
65:34
other
65:35
you know high transaction per second low
65:37
fee networks cardano comes to mind as an
65:39
example of a
65:40
a low transaction fee very high
65:42
transactions per second
65:43
extremely robust technology and what has
65:46
happened to the cardano price over the
65:48
last
65:48
you know 90 days or six months or so
65:52
is it’s you know 20x because people are
65:55
adopting the network and especially in
65:57
you know smaller um you know smaller
65:59
countries and places where
66:01
microtransactions are even more
66:02
important right cardona
66:04
just signed this agreement with you know
66:05
like an african consortium
66:07
and because of this exact reason so you
66:10
know
66:10
this is another great example of the
66:12
open market really driving
66:14
technology adoption which is even better
66:16
right it allows you to iterate quickly
66:18
and and efficiently to a solution
66:20
because you’re not waiting for policy to
66:22
catch up
66:23
you’re not waiting for a bunch of if
66:26
we’re trying to use
66:27
you know like a technological comparison
66:29
the way that society at large works
66:32
right now
66:32
is that people are doing things that
66:34
comply with what government has told
66:36
them to do
66:36
outside of black and gray markets that’s
66:38
you know the majority of things that are
66:40
happening
66:41
in order for something to become policy
66:45
government has to approve it well in
66:46
order for government to approve it a
66:48
bunch of politicians who often have no
66:50
idea what they’re even talking about
66:52
have to get the input of the experts
66:54
which are usually cherry picked
66:56
from various think tanks as well as then
66:59
speaking
67:00
to their put people that actually put
67:02
them in office the cronies who
67:04
gave them the millions of dollars in
67:06
exchange for the trillions of dollars
67:07
that they get
67:08
they put them in office they have to
67:09
hear from them then they do a few town
67:11
halls with voters who often have no idea
67:13
what they’re talking about on the
67:14
subject
67:15
and then they come and say here is what
67:17
we are going to do
67:18
this process can take anywhere from
67:20
several weeks
67:21
to essentially forever it could take
67:23
decades i mean look at marijuana
67:25
legalization we you know
67:26
the public overwhelmingly has supported
67:28
that for well over a decade now
67:30
uh and it’s it could take another decade
67:32
for it to happen
67:33
whereas if you’ve completely
67:35
decentralized everything now now i’m
67:36
doing uh this is i’m blackpilling
67:38
everyone into anarchy right now
67:40
uh that when you when you do when you
67:41
remove all of that
67:44
all of that imposed hierarchy and
67:47
centralization
67:48
and when now the monetary policy isn’t
67:52
being decided by a handful of
67:54
central bankers and and appointed think
67:57
tank policy experts
67:58
who then are have to convince
68:00
politicians who are competing with each
68:02
other on on political posturing
68:03
to make a decision when now it is just
68:05
people who who have
68:07
a stake in fixing this specific issue
68:10
like you said
68:10
the the micro transactions and micro
68:13
financing
68:14
in places like uh you know uh
68:16
sub-saharan africa
68:17
uh very impoverished parts of latin
68:19
america uh
68:20
impoverished parts of east asia
68:22
impoverished parts of the united states
68:24
for that matter
68:24
um people can just provide that solution
68:27
and they don’t have to wait for approval
68:29
they just
68:29
make it and if it works great and if it
68:31
doesn’t someone else can make something
68:32
even better in fact
68:33
it’s not just them making it it’s a
68:34
bunch of other people making their
68:36
competing versions too
68:37
and they’re cooperating versions as well
68:39
and it fixes problems that we don’t even
68:41
necessarily have to know even exist
68:43
because it’s already been dealt with by
68:44
the people that are directly involved in
68:45
that and the providers who sought to
68:47
help them so it’s
68:48
it is an incredible incredible thing to
68:50
me um and the reality is like network
68:53
fees
68:54
there’s anywhere from three to five
68:55
percent network fee right now to use our
68:57
existing system
68:58
and and for many of these it is market
69:00
like cardano i mean it’s it’s
69:02
it’s a it’s a it’s not even a nuisance
69:04
fee it’s a you don’t even feel
69:06
that the amount that’s being taken out
69:07
of it for the transaction so that’s
69:09
that’s incredible the fiat on ramp that
69:12
pretty much gets dealt with once people
69:13
aren’t using fiat anymore right
69:16
yeah the fiat on ramp is is the problem
69:18
that i don’t have a solution to right
69:19
not right now anyways right
69:21
um that’s the real issue with you know
69:23
policy makers and things like this is
69:24
that’s that’s the thing that you can
69:25
affect
69:26
right is you can affect how people get
69:28
their cash into this
69:29
system now the only thing that it
69:31
doesn’t do is it doesn’t you know
69:32
prevent you from going peer-to-peer
69:34
all right there are a bunch of other
69:35
ways to get into this system too there’s
69:37
like
69:38
bitcoin atms google go to google maps
69:40
and google bitcoin atms i guarantee you
69:43
you’ll be shocked at how many bitcoin
69:44
atms
69:45
are anywhere near you at any given time
69:47
and the first sign to me
69:49
of bitcoin mainstream adoption honestly
69:51
and i told my wife and she even she was
69:53
like she
69:54
i have she’s been blue pill on bitcoin
69:56
for longer than
69:57
uh a lot of us but even she even she was
69:59
shocked to hear that you know
70:00
cvs’s and all of these major uh
70:03
walgreens
70:04
uh were putting bitcoin atms in all of
70:06
their stores
70:07
yeah by the end of 2021 i think that
70:09
news came out early last year
70:10
as they were like yep we’re doing it i
70:12
was like she was like what they’re just
70:13
gonna put bitcoin atms and you can buy
70:15
bitcoin or get cash out
70:17
from bitcoin and a select few other
70:18
cryptocurrencies just from an
70:20
atm at a walgreens yep sure can
70:23
only limitation obviously is whatever
70:25
the fees are which probably are probably
70:26
not the best for fees
70:28
but i bet it’s comparable to uh cash
70:30
atms and i bet it’s comparable to using
70:32
a credit card
70:33
or a debit card that this is where it
70:36
gets really really interesting folks
70:38
because
70:39
if the only real limitation left is fiat
70:43
then that means fiat’s the problem
70:47
oh the way you think about everything
70:48
though right yeah like uh people have
70:50
asked me
70:51
you know some of these um interest
70:53
producing centralized and decentralized
70:55
finance
70:56
solutions right your aves your celsius
70:58
your block fi
70:59
you know a lot of people when when i
71:01
start talking about bitcoin and some of
71:02
the other things
71:02
yeah but what about this stuff how do
71:04
they make how do they pay you seven
71:05
percent interest
71:07
for just putting your coins there right
71:09
or putting your value there whatever it
71:10
is how do they do that you’re like well
71:11
how does a bank
71:12
make money how does a bank take your
71:15
take your dollars
71:16
and make and make money on it they’re
71:17
like well and there and i was like and
71:19
not only that but do they pay you any
71:21
money for it
71:22
you know because they used to right in
71:24
the 60s and 70s you used to make
71:26
two or three percent on that value
71:27
because the banks knew that
71:29
you knew and the banks knew it had
71:30
intrinsic value they could take your
71:32
money and loan it out for higher value
71:33
they said
71:34
we’ll give you some value for it they
71:35
just stopped right the centralization of
71:38
this infrastructure
71:39
just stopped working for people and then
71:41
when you start making it work for people
71:42
again everyone goes whoa
71:44
this is what it’s supposed to be like
71:46
this is what my value
71:47
should be making for me because it’s my
71:50
value and if people are using it
71:52
to loan out or to you know make markets
71:56
with
71:56
then i should be getting a a
71:58
compensation
71:59
for the value that i am placing in that
72:01
market then i should
72:03
right and now you see exactly
72:04
infrastructures that are rewarding you
72:06
for that
72:06
and people are gravitating towards them
72:08
once you understand a lot of the
72:10
infrastructure at least
72:11
right there are some nuance here but
72:12
once you understand some of the stuff
72:13
you go wait
72:15
why is why isn’t my life like this
72:16
already
72:18
the fact whatever however much wealth
72:21
you have in a bank right now is being
72:23
leveraged to make money for other people
72:26
and you might be getting 0.2 percent
72:30
back for that maybe
72:33
when and your money is losing way more
72:37
value
72:38
during that time so by having your money
72:40
sit there
72:41
instead of in like a stock or something
72:42
else where it hopefully gains a little
72:44
bit more
72:44
uh you’re you’re you’re you’re
72:47
guaranteeing a slow
72:48
death of the value of your money whereas
72:50
in in a blockchain environment
72:52
not only does the crypt the money the
72:55
currency whatever you want to call it
72:56
your coins
72:56
or even tokens that you’re using not
72:58
only do they gain
73:00
or at least retain their value and
73:01
intrinsically because of
73:03
more and more money entering this more
73:05
and more value entering this
73:06
this sector but you also could
73:08
potentially gain in terms of the
73:10
the amount of that thing that you have
73:12
because other people would love for you
73:14
to stake it with them so they can use it
73:15
and grow it and give you some of it too
73:17
it’s it’s it’s and because it’s not a
73:19
centralized system anymore and because
73:21
there’s so many different competing
73:22
systems
73:23
there’s a vest they have a vested
73:24
interest i say this all the time
73:26
get government out of money and give it
73:28
to the free market
73:29
and or have the free market pry it from
73:33
government by being so much better which
73:34
is really what’s happening right now
73:37
and eventually instead of get having a
73:38
monopoly decide what your money’s worth
73:40
which means they can play with it
73:41
however they want to
73:42
they it’s now being decided by people
73:44
who know you don’t have to use them you
73:46
can use someone else
73:47
you don’t have to use ethereum ethereum
73:48
will have to fix this problem
73:50
with the transaction fees because if
73:52
they don’t
73:54
they’ll lose business to other emerging
73:57
uh or even existing competitors like
73:59
cardano or even like bitcoin
74:01
uh so they will have to fix that we we
74:04
don’t have to wait for a government to
74:05
force them to fix this unfair thing for
74:07
mike
74:08
they’ll have to or else they’re going to
74:09
lose out on that entire market or
74:11
they’ll decide you know what we don’t
74:12
care about that market you guys can
74:13
provide that market we’re going to be
74:14
the big transaction market providers
74:16
okay that’s their decision to make but
74:20
as long as there is a need uh it will uh
74:23
it will be provided um someone uh
74:26
i saw it before in the comments uh we’ve
74:28
had quite a few uh someone was talking
74:30
about
74:30
uh you know the fact that you know what
74:32
if government tries to
74:34
you know quote unquote take this over
74:35
there is really no taking this
74:37
over that’s that’s the beauty of the
74:39
blockchain is that it is so
74:41
decentralized that you there’s no take
74:45
as long as a as long as i can have a
74:47
version of a hard wallet on a device
74:50
you can’t take it over there there is no
74:52
way to take it over can can you just
74:54
briefly talk about why no organization
74:56
can take over
74:57
the blockchain or a blockchain yeah so
75:00
let’s let’s start with
75:01
if they could have taken it over they
75:03
would have already
75:04
right yes and so that’s the first the
75:06
first thing and that doesn’t prove
75:07
anything but it’s a really great
75:08
starting point
75:09
right and think about something else
75:10
that type that tried to decentralize you
75:12
know infrastructures and didn’t do it
75:13
correctly
75:14
like a napster right that was shut down
75:17
and
75:17
and effectively stopped by government
75:19
and entities right because what did they
75:20
do they had centralized servers
75:23
distributing this infrastructure uh or
75:25
you know they had
75:26
groups of people that were acting as
75:27
centralized servers and they shut these
75:29
things down
75:30
another example would be yep oh yeah no
75:33
i said yeah no i said yes i said i’m
75:35
agreeing with you go ahead
75:36
another great example would be you know
75:38
uh video game currencies
75:39
there have been examples uh over time
75:42
where video game currencies started
75:43
being used as
75:45
a pseudo value exchange right
75:48
and government stepped in and said whoa
75:50
whoa whoa you’re not doing this right
75:52
because what do they have they had
75:53
servers that were acting as
75:55
ledgers to distribute this value right
75:58
and so the government stepped in
75:59
in the in the european union in the
76:01
united states and they said no
76:02
those are ours same thing with like
76:04
email servers and stuff like this if
76:05
they don’t like what you have
76:06
they confiscate these things okay
76:08
confiscate bitcoin servers
76:11
they don’t exist there are no servers
76:13
anywhere
76:14
it’s a decentralized ledger there is
76:17
nothing to confiscate
76:18
right then he said okay well what if
76:20
they shut down mining
76:22
okay if you shut down mining in the
76:23
united states you’ve effectively
76:25
shut yourself off from the largest
76:26
transaction one of the largest
76:28
transactional networks on the planet
76:29
right
76:30
what you’re going to do is set yourself
76:31
back the the two countries that come to
76:33
mind that could do this
76:35
that it would be really tough to like
76:37
wrap your head around
76:38
the us and china right right even then
76:40
what they’re doing is they’re stifling
76:42
their own growth
76:43
and the competing forces between the us
76:44
and china would say well i’m not going
76:46
to stifle my growth if they’re not going
76:47
to stifle their own their own
76:48
technological growth in this space
76:50
so there you go we’ve already we’ve just
76:51
disproven the entire thing
76:53
and even gone out to the nth degree that
76:55
one of the two competing superpowers
76:57
decides to do it and they wouldn’t do it
76:58
either
76:59
so you’re just there’s just no way you
77:02
disproved it from the beginning if they
77:03
were gonna do it they if they could do
77:05
it it would have already happened
77:06
long back would have been it would have
77:07
been way easier to do it ain’t happening
77:10
it’s not it’s not happening and what’s
77:11
interesting is the reason they didn’t do
77:12
it earlier was because it wasn’t worth
77:14
enough for them to do
77:15
now that it is it’s too late it’s that
77:17
that’s the beauty of blockchain
77:18
the reason it can’t be defrauded or
77:20
taken over is because when it’s easy
77:22
enough to do it’s not worth it what
77:23
it’s a dollar i’m gonna get a dollar for
77:25
all this effort to do no you know back
77:27
when you know what was it ten thousand
77:29
ten thousand bitcoin were traded for a
77:31
pizza or whatever what was the point of
77:33
taking the plot it’s it’s worth nothing
77:34
it’s worth 50 bucks or whatever
77:36
now it’s worth it and it’s like well now
77:38
we can’t it’s too big and too involved
77:40
to do it
77:40
it’s it’s an incredible incredible
77:42
technology so
77:43
the last thing i want to talk about you
77:45
are you know
77:46
your background and you are a cyber
77:49
security expert
77:50
now there are some a lot of security and
77:52
privacy implications to all of this
77:55
we are talking about moving into a
77:56
completely new way
77:58
of everything i i don’t think i can
78:01
overstate and i know people are thinking
78:03
yeah yeah money
78:05
everything insurance
78:08
arbitration physical infrastructure
78:12
communication travel
78:15
supply chain every single thing
78:19
that it takes to have a functional
78:22
society
78:23
and things that we don’t even know
78:24
things that we don’t even talk about yet
78:26
because there hasn’t been the technology
78:28
to be able to do it
78:29
all the things that we do now as well as
78:31
things that don’t even exist yet
78:33
will be able will be done through this
78:35
if this changes
78:36
everything how do we move into this
78:38
completely new
78:40
restructurization of society while still
78:43
protecting individual privacy and
78:46
security
78:48
yeah so security is my my major focus
78:51
and the thing that i think i
78:52
you know we can talk about to secure the
78:54
most right privacy is a little bit more
78:55
ephemeral because
78:56
you know you see that some of these
78:58
privacy coins are being you know
79:00
ostracized and even some of the privacy
79:02
solutions like washing coins and things
79:03
like this
79:04
are difficult to do and uh you know are
79:07
oftentimes associated with
79:08
you know at least governmentally
79:09
associated like malicious intent and
79:11
stuff like that so
79:11
i’ll leave privacy for a second and
79:13
we’ll come back okay okay security is
79:15
security is really important right
79:16
because if we don’t get this right
79:18
then it’s gonna be a huge detractor for
79:21
the majority of bitcoin or this
79:24
infrastructure’s life right
79:25
and the classic example is you know a
79:27
lot of people who have
79:29
seen a debate or something like this
79:30
have heard of mount gox right mtg
79:33
yes which was a giant cryptocurrency
79:35
exchange hack
79:36
right and so if you don’t get these
79:38
things right then you have these type of
79:40
events and it detracts from
79:42
your main purpose which is to
79:44
democratize this stuff right
79:45
and mount gox for example example right
79:47
stands for magic the gathering online
79:50
exchange right these guys weren’t trying
79:51
to build a cryptocurrency exchange at
79:53
the time
79:54
they were trying to trade magic cards
79:56
right and so
79:57
like it makes sense that it didn’t work
79:59
out it didn’t really pan out for them
80:02
i didn’t know that i didn’t i didn’t
80:03
know that
80:05
so so that’s the the centralized part
80:10
that’s a centralized part right which is
80:12
which we have to get right
80:13
and and they are doing that well i think
80:15
with you know the wink of austin gemini
80:17
and some of these on fiat on ramps and
80:19
and the code review for the defy and
80:21
these types of things so
80:22
that’s on the technologists and i think
80:24
that you know
80:25
that that is being addressed and i think
80:28
i think that the technologists have an
80:30
understanding of the fact that
80:32
you know if we don’t get this right at
80:34
least somewhat to start there’s going to
80:35
be a problem
80:36
the second part is the general public
80:37
right and so the second part is how do
80:39
you
80:40
secure your stuff and what does security
80:42
mean for you from a value perspective
80:44
right
80:44
and so how you know how you secure your
80:47
actual
80:48
value now right is you have some actual
80:51
money in a wallet
80:52
right you have some money in a bank
80:54
right and you have some money in a
80:56
savings account and a lock box that’s
80:58
even harder to get to
80:59
right so you actually do have tiers of
81:01
security now people don’t think of it
81:02
again because we’re ingrained in this
81:04
society
81:05
and so when people ask me about things
81:07
like wallets like what is a bitcoin
81:09
wallet
81:09
you know what is this bitcoin wallet i
81:11
have online and why is it called
81:12
a hot wallet you’re like it’s a hot
81:14
wallet it’s just like your wallet that
81:16
you carry with you right
81:17
it’s much easier to steal your dollars
81:19
when you carry it with you everywhere
81:21
and you’re out in public with it
81:22
right then it would be if you kept those
81:24
dollars in a safe
81:25
in your basement somewhere right and so
81:28
we have to understand security we have
81:31
to understand this
81:32
from uh you know an individual
81:33
perspective because if you’re going to
81:35
democratize this to everybody then
81:36
everybody has to know it to some extent
81:38
right
81:38
and so there’s a couple of terms here
81:40
there’s hot wallets and cold wallets and
81:42
so hot wallets are those that sit online
81:44
connected to the internet
81:45
those are like your actual physical
81:46
wallets you carry with you you should
81:48
keep
81:48
enough value in there that if you lost
81:50
all of that value it wouldn’t
81:52
it wouldn’t end your life now there are
81:54
times when you keep a lot of money in
81:55
your wallet
81:56
right sometimes you walk around with
81:57
four thousand dollars to buy a jet ski
81:59
right so sometimes you do keep a lot of
82:01
money on you and it makes you
82:02
uncomfortable
82:03
perhaps unless you’re bill gates and you
82:05
don’t care about all that money and yet
82:07
but anyway right
82:08
right right right but in general right
82:10
you don’t want to keep all of that money
82:11
on you at all times
82:13
and so what you do is you keep them in
82:14
cold storage wallets right those are
82:16
wallets that are offline
82:18
that are hardware wallets where’s i have
82:19
an example here i’ve got a couple
82:21
actually
82:22
right i’ve got uh i’ve got this bad boy
82:24
right here uh this bad boy right here
82:26
so these are hardware wallets right
82:28
they’re not connected to anything
82:30
and they hold private keys that hold
82:32
value right
82:33
and so these are these are cryptographic
82:35
solutions right
82:36
that are built into the hardware that
82:38
hold on to the keys
82:40
that secure that value that goes back to
82:42
that public private key
82:43
infrastructure so the public key to
82:45
these is known to everybody you can go
82:47
look up the ethereum public key that’s
82:48
associated with this and see how much
82:50
value is on this thing
82:51
from an ethereum perspective right right
82:53
but the private key is held right here
82:55
and literally you could not get the
82:57
value from
82:58
this this pub the public ledger you
83:00
couldn’t change
83:01
send it anywhere without this key that’s
83:03
connected to nothing
83:05
right and so that’s known as a cold
83:07
storage wallet
83:08
right and these are other this is a more
83:10
secure way to store your bitcoin
83:12
there’s one other thing that you
83:13
probably want to know about and that’s
83:15
called
83:16
multi-sig or multi-signature right and
83:19
so that’s
83:19
the same way as if you were to access a
83:22
trust or something like this
83:23
for a minor or for it doesn’t have to be
83:25
a minor in this case but
83:26
the good example is right two people
83:28
need to sign off on that person getting
83:30
that value right
83:31
and so it’s a very similar process to
83:33
that where you have to have multiple
83:34
private keys
83:35
sign the transaction right so one would
83:37
be a hot wallet one would be your cold
83:39
wallet and one would be stored with a
83:40
custodian
83:41
right my class the classic example that
83:43
comes up to me is casa hodl
83:45
is a company that does this they do
83:46
multi-sig usually for higher value stuff
83:49
right and so it’s
83:53
yeah yeah go ahead go ahead no no i was
83:54
just saying that’s cool
83:56
so it’s a you know and and then you say
83:58
okay well travis this sounds
83:59
you know technologically complex and
84:01
it’s kind of
84:02
you know it’s annoying to learn this new
84:04
stuff right and what what’s happening is
84:06
right we are
84:07
simplifying the process and trying to
84:09
streamline the security
84:10
while giving you that ease of
84:12
functionality right and so you have
84:14
these
84:14
hot wallets that are easier to use right
84:16
your coinbase hot wallet your coinbase
84:18
wallet which is different than the
84:19
exchange people don’t know this but
84:21
coinbase is an exchange where you can
84:23
trade coins and stuff they have a wallet
84:25
that is a phone app that you can hold
84:27
tokens on and you can hold bitcoin on
84:29
and you can send it to someone if you
84:31
want it to right
84:32
those are two different things and so uh
84:35
cash app has one of these a hot wallet
84:37
right that has a public address you can
84:39
send to it and you can send from it
84:41
and so we are we are streamlining this
84:43
process we did this with the internet
84:45
right
84:46
we at first everything was sent in clear
84:48
text with http
84:49
and if you saw the transmission you
84:51
could see what was happening this is why
84:53
we couldn’t send credit cards why they
84:54
told you not to put any private
84:56
information on the internet anymore at
84:57
all
84:58
right and then they streamlined that
84:59
security process and made it better and
85:01
easier and now you can click a button on
85:03
amazon
85:04
and get the product to your house and
85:05
have the value pulled out of your bank
85:06
account right
85:07
give give the technologist some time and
85:09
this will be the standard it will be
85:11
easy
85:12
for you if you want to do it ahead of
85:14
time and gain an
85:15
early mover advantage and an
85:17
understanding as this is being developed
85:19
then then participate in the
85:20
infrastructure right go on and make
85:22
yourself a coinbase
85:24
account or whatever it is you want to do
85:25
buy a piece of digital art
85:27
right with ethereum and have have your
85:29
own one-off
85:30
nft and non-fungible token right do
85:32
something in the space
85:34
when it’s you know when it’s not a
85:36
ubiquitously adopted technology yet
85:39
it’s incredible and and like you said
85:41
the
85:43
it’s already arguably more secure than
85:45
the current system that we have in place
85:47
which is why they have
85:48
fdic because
85:52
defrauding happens all the time
85:55
robbery robbing banks happens all the
85:57
time
85:58
uh uh uh what’s word i’m looking for
86:02
counterfeiting are you kidding me uh
86:06
uh there was something i read i forget
86:07
that the number but like double digit
86:09
num percentages of 20 bills
86:12
are that are in circulation right now
86:14
are expected to be fraudulent
86:17
um so i mean that’s that’s beyond any
86:20
any kind of of level of
86:22
of uh hacking or or defrauding or
86:25
anything like that we’ve seen
86:26
in crypto and almost all of that that’s
86:29
happened has been in those centralized
86:32
exchanges that like you i didn’t know it
86:33
was magic the gathering but
86:35
they literally created it for something
86:36
else it then grew into this other thing
86:38
they didn’t have
86:39
anywhere near the security in place that
86:41
they needed to
86:42
and so they got exposed and hacked but
86:45
that was on that centralized system
86:47
as the technology grows and i love that
86:50
you use the internet as an example a lot
86:51
of people don’t remember in their mid
86:52
90s they were like do not
86:54
put your credit card on this thing there
86:56
is no real way to protect it
86:58
but then all the encryption stuff came
87:00
out we’re up to what 256-bit encryption
87:02
now
87:03
um you know that’s and and i’m sure
87:05
we’ll be at 512 and and
87:07
probably already are at this point you
87:08
know that’s happening
87:10
in in in this space as well so it will
87:12
get safer and safer and more and more
87:14
secure
87:15
the comparison i like to use and this is
87:17
a whole other rabbit hole
87:18
is hearing aids and this isn’t about
87:21
security it’s about
87:22
improvement when hearing aids first came
87:24
out
87:27
you only use them in the worst case
87:28
scenarios because they didn’t sound good
87:31
they often were you know they were like
87:34
popping and clicking sounds that they
87:35
made and things like that
87:36
and it was really like if you were if it
87:39
was either this or be
87:40
deaf use this but it’s not going to be a
87:42
pleasant experience
87:43
hearing aids are now where they’re
87:44
actually more sensitive than your
87:46
current hearing they actually work
87:47
better than you’re hearing
87:49
and in a few more years more and more
87:50
people will wear things that are very
87:52
small
87:53
and like hearing aids so that they can
87:54
have superhuman hearing
87:56
uh and that’s gonna happen you know
87:58
they’re just beginning the process of
87:59
replacing the eyes for people that are
88:02
blind and right now they can see like
88:03
very weak shapes and
88:05
and lights and stuff like that that will
88:07
eventually reach a point where people
88:08
will choose to have a little thing right
88:09
here
88:10
so they can see beside behind themselves
88:12
and see and infrared and everything
88:14
else as the technology improves it
88:16
actually replaces
88:18
and isn’t is better than and and and
88:20
immeasurably better than
88:22
what’s already in place um and so yeah i
88:24
only expect that to get to get better
88:27
i also think privacy is something that
88:31
now some people want to have personal
88:32
privacy of like their personal affairs
88:34
and things like that
88:35
but privacy when it comes to money often
88:38
is more about
88:39
protection it’s a secondary security
88:41
thing if you don’t know i have the money
88:44
then you can’t take it but if we have a
88:46
blockchain that is so secure that i can
88:48
be like hey listen i got all
88:50
i have a bazillion trillion bitcoin and
88:52
there’s nothing you can do to take it
88:54
from me
88:55
then now it doesn’t the privacy becomes
88:56
a lesser concern right like if it
88:58
if it’s so secure that it doesn’t matter
89:00
that you know i have it
89:02
then ultimately the privacy becomes a
89:05
lesser concern if the security is better
89:06
right
89:07
yep it does uh you know there’s always
89:09
the old wrench attack
89:11
right where you could hit over the head
89:12
with a wrench but
89:14
other than that right yeah i mean that’s
89:16
the one that’s the one thing right
89:18
yeah you pointed out though right if you
89:19
don’t know i have it we call this
89:21
security
89:21
through obscurity right and it’s really
89:23
not a security tenant it’s not a
89:25
security tenant in the cyber security
89:26
space
89:27
it’s not a security tenant in the
89:28
monetary space right you’d much rather
89:30
have
89:30
a an immensely secure infrastructure to
89:33
hold on to your value
89:34
and everyone know that you had the value
89:36
then a very weakly secured
89:38
infrastructure and hope that people
89:39
didn’t know you had that value right
89:41
right exactly someone mentioned in here
89:44
that you know
89:45
even if government can’t take something
89:46
over they can try to
89:48
and that’s absolutely uh that’s
89:49
absolutely the case
89:51
um in the case of crypto
89:54
and blockchain i still say that this
89:58
is it’s the equivalent of me if i say so
90:00
like you were on my friend
90:02
uh derek uh derek’s show on derek
90:04
britton show
90:05
i may say to you i don’t like that
90:08
you’re on derek’s show
90:09
you have to choose right now either you
90:11
go on derek’s show or you go on my show
90:13
from now on you can either be my friend
90:14
or his friend
90:15
and you can’t do it you might choose
90:19
him what if you like him better
90:21
hypothetically what if you like him
90:22
better and you want to be on his show
90:23
i just alienated myself if i say to you
90:26
you’re not allowed to do that you can’t
90:28
go on derek’s show and you go i’m going
90:30
to go on it anyway
90:31
then you do and i can’t possibly
90:34
control your life enough to keep you
90:37
from
90:37
talking to derek applying this to
90:40
government if these systems are better
90:42
than anything government can do
90:43
and we’re largely continuing to
90:45
cooperate with government
90:47
because it’s it’s just easier for us to
90:50
to cooperate with government
90:51
than not to but then they cut us off
90:54
from something that is way better than
90:56
them
90:56
a lot maybe not all of us but a large
90:58
number of people are going to be like
90:59
okay i’ll just take my chances with them
91:01
and and just not participate in you at
91:02
all and just completely opt out
91:04
and if they speed along that process uh
91:07
derek says in the comments of course
91:08
travis likes me more
91:10
we’ll find out right now no um uh
91:13
go go ahead sorry travis you do have
91:15
more followers so
91:16
you know i don’t know
91:20
i’ve known him derrick is an amazing guy
91:23
listen you should choose derek he’s a
91:24
much better guy than i
91:25
am since i’m always three years old i’m
91:27
gonna go i’m gonna i’m just gonna go to
91:28
you
91:29
immediately that’s that’s i was going to
91:30
say my [ __ ] my show’s been around three
91:32
years his has been around for like 12
91:34
seconds and he’s already got to go you
91:35
may not want to bet on on me having more
91:37
followers because he’s
91:38
i think he has the better growth pattern
91:40
but go but go ahead the
91:41
the analog i like is if you’re scared of
91:44
the government taking your
91:45
your bitcoin or cryptocurrency right
91:46
it’s much harder for them to take that
91:48
than it is for them to take your house
91:50
so if you’re if you’re concerned about
91:52
them taking your bitcoin you should
91:53
probably be concerned about the
91:54
government coming and taking some other
91:55
asset of yours
91:57
your money all your money yeah yeah your
91:59
money is even yeah right
92:01
i mean you’re that’s the thing right and
92:03
we see this over and over in societies
92:05
that don’t understand
92:07
that don’t that don’t have as a great
92:09
monetary infrastructure as we do right
92:11
now that it’s great but
92:12
not as uh sustainable right lebanon
92:16
your venezuela your brazil your
92:18
argentina
92:19
right when you see hyper inflation or
92:21
rapid inflation like you see in lebanon
92:23
what’s the first thing that you see
92:25
you see people moving from that currency
92:27
to digital currencies immediately
92:29
well they try to move to dollars but
92:31
lebanon for example won’t allow you to
92:32
move to dollars so then they go to
92:34
cryptocurrency right
92:35
right right yeah it just it fixes all
92:38
these problems
92:39
but it also is just there’s no effective
92:42
way other than again going back to the
92:43
what if they turn off the internet okay
92:44
great then they’ll destroy themselves in
92:46
the proc
92:47
the only way you can effectively tell
92:48
everyone they can’t use crypto is to
92:50
shut off the internet
92:51
can you imagine what would happen to the
92:52
u.s economic system if they shut the
92:54
internet out it would cry it would be
92:55
nothing
92:56
it would completely crumble uh and the
92:58
government would suffer
92:59
horribly because like i mean it’s just
93:02
the ways to do it aren’t really
93:04
effective and anything they try to do to
93:05
do that will simply hasten along their
93:07
own demise
93:08
and i will say their demise i believe
93:10
that crypto and i i’m you don’t have to
93:12
agree with me on this this is my opinion
93:14
i believe that blockchain will
93:15
eventually allow us to simply opt out of
93:18
government so much
93:19
that that we’ll say yeah no we don’t
93:21
need the courts we’ll use this
93:22
arbitration system it’s way better and
93:23
more equitable
93:24
and is proven to work better yeah no we
93:26
don’t need your
93:27
you know your financial system this
93:29
one’s way better yeah no we don’t really
93:31
need anything you’re doing we don’t need
93:32
your
93:33
your welfare system our our our
93:35
blockchain mutual aid works a thousand
93:37
times better and is far more equitable
93:39
and we aren’t robbing anyone in the
93:40
process
93:41
you know there’s it will be able to come
93:43
up with such such better solutions
93:44
because it’s essentially
93:45
and this is me this is my interco
93:47
capitalism coming in this is the market
93:49
this is just the pure
93:51
market uh that is you know being derived
93:54
from
93:55
need or or or basically supply
93:59
assigned to demand and and and creating
94:02
new markets as a result of it i i could
94:04
i could do this all day long i love it
94:05
it’s the way you talk about it though it
94:07
creeps me out because i start going down
94:08
the rabbit hole too and i’m not
94:10
and i’m and i’m not of the same ilk as
94:12
you in terms of
94:13
you know your staunch political belief
94:15
like in that way
94:16
and it still it and it creeps me some
94:18
someone who’s like relatively moderate
94:20
right where i’m like okay so
94:21
so the government’s printing dollars to
94:24
fund stuff right
94:25
i don’t want dollars and they’re trying
94:28
to
94:28
tell me that i need more dollars and
94:30
every dollar i have is trying to get out
94:32
of dollars
94:33
so where does the dollar go and then
94:35
where does that leave my government
94:36
right it’s it’s creepy right and then
94:38
you start thinking about some of the
94:39
other things about how the dollar worked
94:41
to disenfranchise people right
94:43
you’re working four dollars and every
94:45
hour that you worked is worth 40 percent
94:47
less every two decades right
94:49
and so what you’re doing is you’re
94:50
sitting on the backs of people who are
94:52
getting their time denominated in
94:53
dollars
94:54
and you’re eating their time right by by
94:56
devaluing the currency and so people who
94:58
have things that aren’t dollars right
95:00
like businesses like uh like uh
95:04
real estate like gold whatever it is
95:06
that isn’t denominated in dollars
95:08
are flourishing at an exponential rate
95:10
now as we did not as we
95:11
devalue the dollar right and the people
95:13
who aren’t are being crushed right
95:15
that’s what they and that’s part of this
95:17
you know k-shape recovery and all these
95:18
other things right but it’s it’s scary
95:20
and spooky
95:21
and it’s just and it’s only being you
95:23
know clearly illustrated it’s it’s
95:25
clearly being illustrated here
95:27
i think it is this is anarchy
95:30
whether people like it or not this is it
95:32
is an
95:33
absent of of imposed hierarchy system
95:38
that is a definition of anarchy this is
95:40
people whose
95:41
position it is based entirely on their
95:43
merit the stake that they have
95:45
how much they’re participating how much
95:47
value they’re providing to others
95:48
this is this is anarchy
95:52
i know it’s scary if you’re not an
95:53
anarchist but this is literally anarchy
95:55
and it’s why it’s better than that’s we
95:57
can go into a whole thing on there
95:59
but but the reality is that this is
96:02
and and and you know when when
96:04
government
96:05
the if the like i said before if the
96:07
biggest problem
96:08
is related to well but what’s government
96:11
going to do
96:12
and well but how do i get my money out
96:13
of my my store of value out of this
96:16
diminishing
96:17
this you know increasingly valueless
96:20
fiat
96:21
that’s a condemnation of that system
96:24
that that’s the
96:25
the weakest link here and uh yeah no
96:27
it’s it’s it’s incredible
96:29
it is spooky if you if you believe we
96:31
need a government
96:32
as someone who doesn’t believe we do and
96:34
who thinks that that’s an art of
96:35
artificial imposition that’s been
96:36
imposed upon us this
96:38
is it’s almost like increasingly
96:41
it won’t be the political process it’ll
96:43
simply just be the reality
96:45
that this works so much better and
96:48
there’s nothing
96:49
in the past anarchistic solutions could
96:52
be stopped
96:52
a mutual aid society could be stopped by
96:55
people coming in and physically making
96:56
them not do it anymore
96:58
when it’s in this kind of system
97:01
you can’t stop it and not only can you
97:03
not stop it you don’t have to be a why
97:05
you’re not an anarchist you’re a
97:06
political moderate most of the people
97:08
involved in this are not necessarily
97:10
political anarchists
97:11
they’re just doing it because it makes
97:12
the most sense so you don’t have to be a
97:15
wild-eyed anarchist anymore to
97:16
participate in this what is essentially
97:18
counter economics this this this this
97:21
growing exponential agarism that’s
97:23
happening
97:24
you don’t have to be all about that to
97:27
be a part of it you just have to
97:28
be a part of this thing happening it is
97:31
incredible to me
97:31
it it certainly can be scary but as
97:34
someone
97:35
uh who you know who has been waiting for
97:37
this to happen for quite some time
97:39
it it it’s a pretty exciting thing and
97:41
and and the beauty of it happening is
97:43
it’s happening gradually so that
97:45
you know people aren’t waking up one day
97:47
and going oh my gosh everything is
97:49
weird and looks different from how it it
97:51
just like the internet took
97:53
years to go from you know
97:55
[Music]
97:56
and then you get to talk to someone to
97:59
us doing this type of thing and then all
98:00
the new stuff that’s going to be down
98:02
the road for the internet um that’s how
98:04
it’s going to be with blockchain too so
98:06
i think it’s
98:06
i think it’s absolutely incredible and
98:08
you you look scared and i’m sorry
98:10
yeah the more the more you know the
98:11
thing that really just drives it home
98:13
for me and why i like doing these things
98:14
i did your podcast and derricks and
98:16
whatnot right
98:17
is it just seems like the more you know
98:18
the more sense it makes right you don’t
98:20
have to be
98:21
a cryptographic expert now especially
98:23
right to start going okay
98:25
i mean yeah i’d rather have this stuff
98:27
right
98:28
and the to your point about the
98:29
evolution of the internet um if you ever
98:31
looked at technology adoption curves
98:32
over the last like 100 years
98:33
right the curves just start going
98:35
quicker and quicker and quicker
98:37
right so it’s a bell curve it goes like
98:39
that and the adoption of you know cars
98:42
right took
98:42
40 years the adoption of the telephone
98:45
took 25
98:46
the adoption of the internet took nine
98:48
right the adoption of cryptocurrency
98:50
and i’m you know over generalizing but i
98:52
mean it’s going to be
98:54
much more immediate than you would have
98:56
ever thought as a result of just the way
98:58
the technology is developing right
99:00
it’s it’s just it just is the way a new
99:02
technology comes and it is it is adopted
99:05
exponentially more quickly and that’s a
99:06
that’s exponential there is
99:08
is an actual you know exponent yeah yeah
99:11
it is adopted exponentially more quickly
99:13
and i’m a stickler for that too by the
99:14
way with my background of research
99:16
i can’t say my people oh i’m sure you
99:17
are and don’t and use term
99:19
use mathematics terms incorrectly people
99:22
will say
99:22
exponentially to describe something that
99:24
has increased by 50
99:25
and i’m like stop doing that and they’re
99:28
like or even for something that
99:29
increased 500 i’m like if it’s not at
99:31
least a thousand percent then it’s not
99:33
increment it’s not
99:34
exponential there has to be an order of
99:37
magnitude involved either up or down
99:38
like you cannot
99:40
stop saying expo now if something went
99:41
down by 90 that is exponential but if
99:43
something went down by 80 percent stop
99:45
saying exponential
99:46
anyway that’s it it has a slope yes
99:49
that’s that’s not a
99:50
it has a slope if it’s not doing this
99:52
it’s not exponential
99:53
so uh it’s it’s it’s incredible so
99:56
uh matthew stiltner said you know now uh
99:59
sharon in africa bob and liberia and
100:01
frank in the u.s have equal value to the
100:03
system they support
100:04
if they provide the same service so we
100:05
created more worldwide value of people
100:07
through the decentralization of money
100:09
now africa is no longer a value base
100:11
that is point zero zero zero zero one
100:13
percent of the us dollar based on the
100:15
fact that someone else
100:16
attached those values to that person
100:17
based on current currency transfer
100:19
exactly
100:21
exactly this we talk about
100:24
egalitarianism
100:25
uh i don’t use the term democratization
100:28
because it implies
100:30
a a a win-lose
100:34
style system in a in a system of
100:36
governance
100:37
if i can get 51 of people to
100:40
sign up to something the other 49 are
100:42
disenfranchised as a result
100:43
but this we can use democratize or
100:46
decentralizes
100:47
everything and it’s it’s it’s incredible
100:49
so i we could we can do this
100:51
it’s a long way and you can become more
100:52
and more scared as we talk and i hate to
100:54
see because you’re just sitting there
100:55
like
100:56
yeah i’m coming around man we gotta i
100:58
gotta listen to a couple more of these
101:00
things
101:01
watch my shows i listen you’ll be in
101:02
anarchy my my the the co-owner of muddy
101:05
waters media
101:06
was a constitutionalist minikis when i
101:08
met him he’s now an anarchist
101:09
most the people on my team when i met
101:11
him were bernie bros and and yang
101:13
gangers
101:13
and uh and and uh and other types of
101:16
liberty leaning people they’re now all
101:17
aner because i make people an anarchist
101:19
that’s my job that’s
101:20
that’s that’s my job is i lived in
101:22
democratic socialism in sweden for two
101:24
years so
101:24
i liked it it was a nice place hey
101:27
listen
101:28
a system whereby democratic socialism is
101:31
a decentralization compared to our
101:33
system
101:34
which is why some of the things are
101:36
fairer and more equitable
101:37
also they don’t have a worldwide
101:39
imperialist system that’s built on the
101:41
built on mass murder or a internal
101:43
system that’s built on
101:45
uh enslaving people uh for the benefit
101:47
of of uh you know uh private prisons and
101:49
free labor contractors but but same
101:52
thing that you know
101:53
we have you know for all of our talk
101:55
about land of the free home of the brave
101:56
we’re one of the most centralized
101:57
systems out there
101:58
compared with the exceptions of maybe
102:00
like a china or a venezuela
102:02
or a uh a zimbabwe and you see what’s
102:04
happening in those countries even in
102:06
china
102:07
if you want to start a business it’s
102:08
actually easier there than here
102:10
um and and and that’s why they’re
102:12
they’re they’re having their upswing
102:13
they are
102:14
but then socially they’re very repressed
102:16
and that’s why they have the social
102:17
issues they have
102:18
repression and centralization equals
102:20
stagnation
102:22
and and and problems as a result the
102:24
abusive and inequitable outcome
102:26
i’m anarchy killing you by the way but
102:27
uh you know that it leads to the more
102:29
you suppress something the more you
102:30
centralize it the more you control it
102:32
the more repressed and the more abused
102:35
and the more
102:36
neglected people are within that system
102:38
the more you decentralize it we’re
102:40
seeing that where we’re talking about
102:41
blockchain and crypto the more
102:43
decentralized it is
102:44
the more that power is disseminated out
102:47
based on merit and value as opposed to
102:50
imposed hierarchy
102:52
the fairer it is the less abuse there is
102:54
the less harm that there is
102:56
you know we could very well have a
102:58
health care system that is based on
102:59
blockchain
103:01
we could very well have a system
103:04
of residency and vetting that is based
103:08
on blockchain
103:09
instead of immigration protocols and
103:11
standards this can apply to
103:13
everything and be far more efficient and
103:16
be
103:17
far fairer and be far more equitable
103:19
because they’re being designed
103:20
in favor of and by the people that are
103:22
directly staked in that thing as opposed
103:24
to being imposed on it centrally
103:26
by someone who has no real stake in it
103:28
other than wanting to continue to
103:29
impose power on everyone else that’s the
103:32
beauty of this
103:33
i hope i haven’t scared you too much but
103:35
this estonia is doing the same thing
103:36
right estonia
103:37
they are going to be able to apply this
103:39
to blockchain right they are taking a
103:40
cryptographic chip and putting it in
103:42
each one of their uh
103:43
their you know their social ids and
103:45
their health care system is tied to that
103:47
cryptographic chip their health history
103:48
their social their social security
103:50
number their credit card or you know
103:51
whatever it is their credit score all
103:52
these things like
103:53
it’s tied to their cryptographic
103:54
signature okay so inside your
103:56
cryptographic signature why can’t it be
103:58
tied to some decentralized ledger
103:59
instead of their you know corp instead
104:01
of their governmental backbone right
104:02
and so now all of your all of your
104:04
health history all of your credit score
104:05
all of your other stuff
104:06
all these other things are tied to you
104:08
right and everyone agrees that they’re
104:10
you instead of
104:10
estonia proving that it’s you exactly
104:13
instead of relying on estonia’s system
104:15
which is
104:16
corruptable and and you know easily
104:18
hackable and everything else
104:20
and here’s what it comes down to every
104:21
day more and more people wake up and go
104:24
wait why do i need government this is
104:25
that’s the part i like as more and more
104:27
people like they go and they’re like
104:28
yeah i know that my insurance and my
104:30
security and my this and everything
104:31
isn’t that man it’s so much better and
104:33
i’m actually gaining
104:34
value i’m a landlord now i can have my
104:36
my stuff sitting there and staked out
104:38
i’m gaining value i get to work
104:39
you know uh i don’t have to work as long
104:41
and and now i can pursue things that i
104:43
have a passion in
104:44
because i’m i’m i’m able to sit on the
104:46
value of i can i i can
104:48
stake out and sit on the value of others
104:50
and they want to
104:51
because it allows them to be it’s not
104:53
this you know imposed system where i’m
104:54
forcing someone to be my wage slave by
104:56
imposing licensure laws that don’t allow
104:58
them to create their own
104:59
uh their own their own you know uh uh
105:02
enterprise to compete with mine it’s
105:03
just the opposite
105:04
they actually want to do it because they
105:06
can use the stake that i have
105:07
to grow something out of it and more and
105:10
more people wake up from that go
105:12
wait why do we need government i love it
105:14
anyway i i i i’m gonna
105:16
i promise to let you go because we we
105:17
we’re heading up on two hours
105:19
you have been a fantastic guest and i i
105:21
thank you so much for coming on i
105:23
before i let you go i want to give you a
105:24
chance to say anything you want to say
105:27
anything even if it’s i’m scared you are
105:29
you are free to say that now
105:31
whatever you want to say anything you
105:32
want to promote with your with your
105:34
company what you do
105:35
any upcoming events you want anything
105:37
that you want to say however long you
105:38
want to say it
105:39
uh the floor is yours travis
105:43
wentworth we did two hours wow i really
105:46
did i really did not think it was that
105:47
long
105:47
time flies when you’re having fun um i
105:49
appreciate it thank you very much for
105:51
having me on this is a really amazing
105:52
conversation
105:53
um yeah so uh social media and company
105:56
stuff so i am travis iq
105:58
on twitter which is where i’m probably
106:00
the most active if you have questions or
106:01
are interested
106:02
dm me there or shoot me a message and
106:05
we’ll definitely give you some more
106:06
information
106:07
um the company is intelligence quest and
106:09
so that’s why i’m travis iq
106:10
everywhere we have a youtube channel
106:12
called intelligence quest
106:13
and we do cyber security uh fundamentals
106:16
we do some tech deep dives
106:17
we do bitcoin we’re all we’re just
106:20
technologists
106:21
myself and my partner and i’m travis
106:24
underscore
106:24
iq on instagram i usually use that for
106:26
fun tech memes
106:28
things like flaming solar winds for
106:29
their bad hacks and things like this
106:31
um so yeah that’s that’s me in a
106:34
nutshell
106:34
and i really i really appreciate it man
106:36
this was really really fun
106:37
yeah well fun and i know you’re gonna
106:39
you’re gonna message me after this and
106:41
be like why
106:41
why are you trying to make me an
106:43
anarchist i’m sorry go ahead go ahead
106:44
intelligencequest.com so that’s what
106:46
that’s that’s the
106:47
intelligencequest.com we also were asked
106:49
early on and i forgot to ask
106:51
um are you related to jg wentworth
106:54
man i i didn’t i never got that until i
106:57
moved out uh out of new england because
106:58
there’s so many wentworths in new
106:59
england absolutely not
107:00
no uh there’s no company wentworth if
107:02
you’re not from if you’re not from
107:03
the northeast and you don’t know this
107:04
but they’re everywhere in the northeast
107:06
so
107:07
okay um okay so if i if i have a
107:09
structured settlement and i need cash
107:11
now you cannot help me
107:13
i cannot get you any cash and plus you
107:15
already have a guy for that
107:16
so if you have a lawyer that started i
107:19
guess he was personal injury but
107:21
oh yeah no oh no he’ll get me the m no
107:23
see that’s the thing so
107:24
chris chris reynolds can get me that
107:26
structured settlement
107:28
what if i need cash now yeah blockchain
107:31
fixes that by the way anyway
107:32
uh hey thank travis thanks so much for
107:35
coming on uh stick around i’m going to
107:38
talk with you during the outro but hey
107:39
thank you so much man thank you for
107:41
coming on
107:42
awesome thank you you were a fantastic
107:44
guest and folks
107:45
thank you for tuning in to this special
107:47
episode of my fellow americans it’s
107:49
special because all episodes are special
107:50
but thank you for tuning in to this
107:52
episode of my fellow americans uh
107:54
i will see you next week but first if
107:57
you live
107:58
in or near lebanon tennessee or
108:01
absol lebanon i’m sorry lebanon
108:03
tennessee spelled lebanon
108:05
but lebanon tennessee uh i will be there
108:08
on saturday and sunday
108:09
uh for the libertarian party of
108:11
tennessee’s
108:12
uh annual uh convention so be sure to
108:16
come out
108:17
i would love to have you i would love to
108:18
meet you or if i already know you then
108:20
i’d love to see you again because i miss
108:22
you
108:22
the website is lptn libertarian party of
108:26
tennessee lptn.org
108:28
and you can find out more about the
108:29
event you can sign up to uh to be at it
108:31
i’d love to see you
108:32
and uh and then i will join you back
108:34
here uh next on on monday
108:37
uh on my social media monday at eight i
108:39
will be doing my next episode of
108:42
the culture of winning and then on the
108:45
and i think we haven’t i don’t know who
108:46
my guest is yet but i’m gonna have an
108:47
amazing guest for culture winning
108:49
uh then be sure to join me on tuesday uh
108:52
at eight p.m
108:53
for the muddy waters of freedom where
108:54
matt wright and i parse through the
108:56
week’s events
108:56
like the cheerful little 2020 wonder
108:59
boys that we are
109:00
20 20 wonder boys that we are and then
109:03
tune in next week right here
109:07
same spike place same spike time for
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another amazing
109:10
episode of my fellow americans folks
109:13
thanks so much for watching again
109:14
i’m spike cohen and you are the power
109:18
god bless guys
109:34
[Music]
109:40
yay
109:43
[Music]
110:03
[Music]
110:05
[Applause]
110:08
i can’t make a
110:17
[Music]
110:22
if you slide in my kicks it might fit we
110:26
might just
110:27
unite them come together become hybrid
110:30
at the least slightly like-minded indeed
110:33
the life i’ve lived
110:34
brings light to kindness all you need is
110:37
put a cease to the crimes
110:39
put an ease of the minds like mine
110:42
sometimes darkness is all i find
110:44
you know what they say about an eye for
110:45
a night in a time where the blob is the
110:47
blood who am i to deny with cry when a
110:48
loved one dies
110:49
i recognize that body
111:21
[Music]
111:28
tell me why
111:41
[Music]
111:46
yeah change
111:59
we will make a change
112:21
[Music]