(((My Fellow Americans))) #84: Sharyl Attkisson

02:06
oh
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and now live from beautiful myrtle beach
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fellow americans with your host
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spike cohen yes
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yes it’s me happy new year
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didn’t keep clapping welcome to my full
02:41
americans i
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am literally spike cohen thanks again
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uh and i’m no i’m not gonna keep uh
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opening by saying literally for 2021 but
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i’m
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i tried it for this i might do it i
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might keep doing it thanks for tuning in
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to this
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[Music]
06:45
you can taste the kroger shout out to
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tara on turks’s mom as always
06:49
folks my guest tonight is a
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world-renowned
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investigative reporter and also the
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author of a book that came out uh
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just over a month ago called slanted uh
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which talks about
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the growing bias and
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narrative driven nature of major media
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ladies and gentlemen my fellow americans
07:08
please welcome to the show my next
07:10
guest miss cheryl atkinson sheryl thanks
07:13
so much for coming on
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thank you for having me i’m really happy
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to have you on before we get started on
07:18
on your book and and the narrative
07:20
driven nature of media today
07:22
real quick what is it that actually out
07:24
of curiosity what was it that that made
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you decide that you wanted to get
07:27
into being a journalist in your in the
07:30
first place where did you always want to
07:31
be a reporter or was it sort of an aha
07:33
moment something that happened
07:34
what was it that led to that back in my
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day it wasn’t really
07:39
well known as profession i’m talking
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about
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gosh late 70s early 80s and i think
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after my first year in college when you
07:47
have to redeclare your major we all want
07:49
to be psychiatrists and attorneys i
07:51
think
07:51
our freshman year and then we have to
07:52
get serious and um
07:54
a girl that i was going to college with
07:56
said she was going to do journalism
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never heard of that as a profession i
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asked what it entailed
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and when she talked about it it sounded
08:03
like right up my alley i love to write i
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guess that’s my first love you could say
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and then i also think i have a sense of
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fairness
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and a logical mind that likes to do the
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kind of comparisons
08:14
and puzzle solving that lends itself to
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investigative reporting so it turned out
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to be
08:20
really just a sort of a lucky thing well
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it seems to have worked out well for you
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because you’re you’re as well known as
08:25
pretty much any other investigative
08:27
reporter out there um
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now as a libertarian uh we often
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libertarians often joke about being on
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watch lists
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or being uh watched by the fbi that’s a
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common uh
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common joke that we have but you
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actually had that happen you were
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actually spied upon by the people in the
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highest levels of government can you
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tell us a little bit about that
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well i wrote about that in my first book
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stonewalled
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sort of the lengthy revelation i never
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dreamed i was
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being subjected to government
08:53
surveillance because this was before
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it was snowden and before we knew the
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government spying on
08:59
associated press reporters and fox news
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reporter and so on
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so i didn’t dream that was the case but
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i happen to have long story shorts and
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sources in the intel community
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that alerted me that americans were
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being spied on american citizens
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by the obama administration in a way
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that had never been done before and that
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people would be shocked if they knew
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and i was alerted that because of the
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reporting that i was doing i was likely
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being surveilled too
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and i was able to have a contact looked
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at my cbs laptop computer first
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and then my personal desktop computer
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that i use at home
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and the forensics which we have built
09:35
since then through many independent
09:37
examinations filled in
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a lot of really chilling holes about how
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long i was surveilled
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the types of software that was used the
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material they captured
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the tools they used such as skype to
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secretly activate skype when you don’t
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know it’s on and they can exfiltrate
09:52
files and listen in on your audio when
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you don’t know it
09:56
capturing passwords they enter the cbs
09:58
computer system cbs
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issued a news release about this some
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months later and
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i’m still fighting in court because the
10:06
department of justice which is
10:07
responsible
10:08
in a way because the agents work under
10:10
the department of justice
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in part who are responsible for some of
10:14
the surveillance
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they’re still defending the agents all
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these years later as i spend my own
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money trying to sue in court since
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they’re not going to prosecute
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that’s incredible and it’s yeah it’s it
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from what i’ve read they’re pretty much
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stonewalling you in core as a result of
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it and now this all came out of a
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as far as you can tell as a result of
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your investigative reporting on the
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fast and furious gun walking scandal is
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that is that correct
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i was doing so much reporting that
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powerful interests didn’t like whether
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corporations
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some even that republicans wouldn’t have
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liked and certainly some that democrats
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didn’t like
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it’s hard to know exactly what triggered
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it i think i was
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certainly not the only journalist that
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was being spied on so it’s not as though
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they said oh
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cheryl’s doing the stories on fast and
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furious let’s go after her
10:58
they were capturing a lot of american
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citizens and journalists
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in operations to surveil what they were
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doing we now know the extent of some of
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it
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and i think 2016 since that was never
11:09
prosecuted or handled previously was an
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outgrowth our intelligence community
11:13
continuing with their
11:14
some of them bad acts and their spying
11:16
and surveillance of u.s citizens
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so yes they did definitely look at my
11:20
fast and furious files and photographs
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and exfiltrate information
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there was a continuing operation also
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while i was covering
11:28
the benghazi story the magazine attacks
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by islamic extremist terrorists
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in libya on american citizens so you
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know it’s just sort of a
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lengthy uh operation of surveillance
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that
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i was under as well as other people well
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that
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that is i mean it’s it’s incredible to
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think that the government is
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basically spying on at this point almost
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everyone i mean you mentioned edward
11:50
snowden
11:50
his revelation was that pretty much
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every electronic communication we have
11:54
is being spied upon but that’s i mean we
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can do a whole other episode about that
11:56
let’s talk about your book so
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in slanted and i read it um it is
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uh a pretty uh damning uh
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series of examples of the growing bias
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that is in media and not just the the
12:10
individual bias but the fact that media
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as an institution is increasingly being
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driven
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not by an attempt to actually seek out
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the truth
12:19
but an attempt to have a an already
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attempted narrative
12:24
and then build from that and and
12:26
basically cherry pick whatever you can
12:28
for that narrative um can you talk about
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that narrative can you talk about why
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you think that narrative happened in the
12:35
first place because
12:36
in reading through it you know one of
12:38
the biggest things that i
12:39
that i had a hard time walking away with
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is why is this even happening in the
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first place is this a result of
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you know uh too much corporate influence
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or what do you think is the biggest
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reason behind it
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i really try to i think it’s well put
12:53
the way you said it and i
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spent a lot of time in my last book the
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smear dissecting the industry that’s
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responsible for this
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the multi-billion dollar smear industry
13:02
which is comprised of
13:04
llc’s non-profits political action
13:06
committees global law firms corporate
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law firms you name it
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and they figured out over time as i
13:12
tried to describe
13:13
how to get their nose under the tenant
13:14
news organizations to get us to report
13:17
certain things a certain way
13:18
to use their narratives their language
13:21
to not report certain things
13:23
and they were largely successful at this
13:24
and we did not in my view
13:27
um as as an industry put up the
13:29
appropriate firewalls to keep it from
13:32
happening so
13:33
in the 2005-2006 time period when i was
13:36
at cbs news and recognizing
13:38
this encroaching infringement upon fair
13:41
reporting by outside interests and that
13:43
was
13:43
becoming somewhat successful i alerted
13:46
um
13:47
you know people inside cbs including our
13:49
attorneys and said we need to
13:51
figure out how to do more than just play
13:53
defense after the fact when these
13:55
industries
13:56
either successfully prevent us from
13:58
reporting something
13:59
or use these organized attacks with
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their partners in the media and social
14:02
media to controversialize a story
14:05
to say false things about it to come to
14:07
claim the stories wrong and debunked
14:09
to attack the reporters we need to do
14:11
something more offensive now that we see
14:14
this
14:14
industry growing which can be very
14:16
harmful to us telling the facts as they
14:18
are
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but the sad truth is you know we’re so
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busy just being reporters we’re not in
14:23
the pr industry
14:24
we didn’t develop a defensive strategy
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that was good or an
14:28
offensive strategy and it’s only gotten
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worse and now
14:32
i pause it i hope with pretty good
14:34
evidence that not only are these
14:36
interests
14:36
impacting the newsrooms they now work in
14:39
our newsrooms we’ve allowed them to come
14:41
inside we’re one in the same
14:43
which explains this crazy dynamic where
14:46
even if the news organization
14:48
covers something following virtually no
14:50
ethical standards and guidelines that we
14:52
learn to follow in journalism school
14:54
and even when they’re proven wrong about
14:56
what they report there are often no
14:58
repercussions they almost
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dig down double down and say they were
15:01
right or just move on
15:03
because their mission was accomplished
15:05
if you look at them as propagandists who
15:07
are out to
15:08
push a narrative to the public to try to
15:10
make them think a certain way
15:12
they’re doing exactly what they intend
15:14
and it’s not
15:15
you know a mistake on in their on their
15:17
part when they get it wrong
15:19
yeah it’s not a bug it’s a feature at
15:21
this point and it also you talked about
15:23
the increasing
15:24
panelization of news that there will be
15:26
a news item
15:27
and instead of simply presenting the
15:29
facts they then have a panel which
15:31
usually the panel is largely made up of
15:33
people that already agree with their
15:35
predetermined outcome
15:36
many cases people that actually gave
15:38
them the outcome
15:39
and the information and then now they’re
15:41
on to talk about it and maybe they’ll
15:43
put on one or two you know token
15:44
opposition just to
15:46
make it look like it’s it’s fair and
15:47
balanced and uh and it’s an
15:49
incredible dynamic to see and it’s it’s
15:52
really sad because
15:54
not only does it often you know drive us
15:56
into being
15:57
divided but it often ends up backfiring
16:00
you know
16:00
in in many ways they were so hyperbolic
16:03
or at least part of mainstream
16:05
media was so hyperbolic about you know
16:07
reporting
16:08
uh you know about trump that it kind of
16:10
inoculated the public to
16:12
to the way that trump is so that now for
16:14
example you know a lot of people are
16:16
seeing this this uh you know revelation
16:17
about trump
16:18
uh trying to get the uh georgia
16:20
secretary of state to uh
16:22
to find uh votes and most people are are
16:25
kind of to have fatigue about the whole
16:27
thing they’re like yeah you tell us that
16:28
trump’s terrible every single day
16:30
and uh you know do you think that they
16:32
even care at this point do you think
16:34
that it matters
16:35
that that that it matters to them and
16:38
that they might retool
16:39
or do you think that as long as they’ve
16:41
just got people thinking the
16:42
predetermined narrative that’s all that
16:44
really matters to them
16:45
well they only need a certain slice of
16:47
the audience i find hope in the notion
16:49
that whatever you think of donald trump
16:51
the pervasive ubiquitous narrative was
16:54
how dangerous he is and you can’t vote
16:55
for him and so on
16:57
but tens of millions of americans did
16:58
anyway including something like 10
17:00
million more than last time
17:02
which again like or not shows you that a
17:04
huge segment of the american population
17:06
as you said has grown inoculated to
17:09
these narratives in fact they may
17:10
believe
17:11
quite the opposite when they hear
17:13
something put out or when they see a
17:14
fact check
17:16
fact check done they may start to learn
17:18
that that’s really a code for something
17:20
that’s
17:21
true even though the fact check says
17:23
it’s false when there’s a label that
17:24
goes up on twitter these ridiculous
17:26
labels
17:27
that’s that should be a cue now that
17:29
tells you somebody important doesn’t
17:31
want me to look at this
17:32
information and believe it maybe it’s
17:34
true and maybe i should dig in
17:35
more so when you talk about the
17:37
backfiring that’s where
17:38
i find a little bit of hope in these
17:41
trends that i see is very dangerous to
17:43
our information landscape
17:44
but if we can start look looking at
17:46
these things like you say they’ve gone
17:48
overboard with them so i think they
17:50
they are less effective with a certain
17:52
segment of the population
17:54
on the other hand there’s a segment that
17:56
does not have time
17:58
or desire to dig in like maybe some of
18:00
your
18:01
viewers and listeners do and i think
18:03
that’s who they’re going for just repeat
18:05
something over and over again
18:06
true or not and that’s the top line that
18:08
some people will walk away with
18:10
and ask no more questions i hope that
18:13
that is
18:14
what i can take from as many people
18:16
voting or
18:17
the fact that trump actually got more
18:18
votes in 2020 than he did in 2016.
18:21
i part of me wonders if it’s that
18:23
there’s just a growing
18:25
counter narrative that’s happening on
18:26
the right side i mean you look at
18:28
fox is increasingly digging into a
18:31
i guess you know the right of center
18:33
version of of what’s happening in cnn
18:35
and msnbc
18:36
and then you’ve got you know
18:37
organizations like oan oan or oann and
18:41
things like that
18:42
newsmax that are kind of just sort of
18:44
delivering the right-wing version of
18:45
of what has been happening in mainstream
18:48
media do you think that there’s a real
18:50
like demand for unbiased news or often
18:53
when people are saying unbiased does
18:54
that
18:55
just kind of mean agrees with me
18:57
[Music]
18:58
that’s a good question and i think there
19:01
is a demand for both and i’ve spent
19:03
a decade asking this question as news
19:05
has become polarized
19:07
even people who like to get their news
19:09
from cnn
19:10
which is left-leaning or nbc which is
19:12
left-leaning or cbs which is
19:14
left-leaning
19:15
or whether they get their news from
19:17
these other sources that you said that
19:18
are right-leaning
19:20
all of those people that i i’ve asked
19:21
still would like a place where they can
19:23
turn to that’s more like cnn used to be
19:25
when i worked there when it was a news
19:26
organization back in 1990
19:29
where they can just take at face value
19:31
more or less
19:32
the facts that are reported without
19:34
thinking that’s a narrative that
19:35
someone’s trying to shove down my throat
19:37
to the exclusion of
19:38
other facts that may exist they still
19:40
people that want to hear
19:42
what they want to hear still would like
19:44
to go to a place where they don’t have
19:45
to discount what they hear according to
19:47
where they heard it
19:49
and feel like they’re still getting a
19:51
fair recitation of facts and information
19:53
i think there’s a huge market for that
19:55
i hope you’re right i hope you’re right
19:57
um i i
20:00
having just run for uh vice president
20:02
and seeing that of those who even knew
20:04
who we were that they often had
20:07
their their own you know narrative built
20:09
in before they even
20:10
had you know had a chance to listen to
20:12
us i hope that
20:14
however things go forward politically we
20:16
need to be able to have you know
20:19
mainstream sources of media that aren’t
20:22
trying to dissect things ahead of time
20:23
and give you a driven narrative now
20:25
i will say this sort of a um i guess
20:28
devil’s advocate there is an argument
20:31
that some are saying that media actually
20:33
needs to be even more biased
20:34
in the way that it covers news and and
20:36
they’ll give the
20:38
typically as they usually would they’ll
20:39
give an extreme example so for example
20:41
they’ll say if one prominent figure says
20:43
that uh all jews must be rounded up and
20:46
killed
20:46
and another prominent figure says no we
20:48
shouldn’t be rounding up or killing
20:50
anyone
20:51
uh the media you know shouldn’t you know
20:53
come in and say
20:54
that you know that present an unbiased
20:57
uh
20:57
uh presentation of this debate that they
21:00
should come in saying well of course we
21:02
shouldn’t be rounding up and killing
21:03
people
21:04
um obviously that’s a very very extreme
21:06
position but
21:07
do you think uh that there is a line
21:10
where reporters
21:11
should either stop being objective or or
21:14
at the very least be
21:15
be coming in with some kind of level of
21:17
moral clarity and if so
21:19
where or what do you think that line is
21:21
i don’t think it’s something that’s
21:23
a rule that’s true in every single case
21:25
but in part is part of a general
21:27
guideline
21:28
i would say things that are illegal in
21:30
other words
21:31
murder rounding up people killing them
21:34
right that sort of thing you can
21:35
generally as a news organization
21:38
be willing to take more of a position of
21:40
right or wrong in other words
21:42
you can’t decide off the front in my
21:44
view without attribution that somebody’s
21:46
guilty of a crime but you can certainly
21:47
report
21:48
that someone is accused of a crime and
21:50
what’s being said about it
21:51
and it’s certainly fine to report it
21:53
with as if it’s not okay
21:56
if somebody indeed is accused of doing
21:58
heinous crimes and violating the law and
22:00
that sort of thing
22:01
but very few things as you know fall
22:04
along those lines more likely what we’re
22:06
seeing today
22:07
is valid viewpoints or maybe someone
22:10
doesn’t think it’s a valid viewpoint on
22:12
the other side but
22:13
that’s a matter of opinion or maybe
22:14
somebody finds it distasteful but that’s
22:16
kind of none of your business as a news
22:18
reporter in my view
22:19
and too often we’re just saying off the
22:21
top this used to never
22:23
almost never be done by the way we’re
22:25
saying off the top that your delicate
22:27
ears as a viewer listener
22:29
should not hear these facts should not
22:31
read these studies should not hear these
22:32
viewpoints because we don’t trust you
22:35
to make the same discernment that we
22:36
want you to make that we’ve made for
22:38
ourselves and i i think that’s
22:40
way overstepping the bounds of the job
22:42
of what a journalist has
22:44
it’s led to bad reporting and inaccurate
22:47
reporting that’s been really obvious
22:48
over the past couple of years
22:50
and i think it’s a really bad and
22:51
dangerous trend so the notion that we
22:54
yes we’re gatekeepers to some degree
22:56
because we can’t put every piece of
22:58
information out there’s not enough space
23:00
and time so we’re always making
23:02
decisions
23:03
but the notion that we get to decide a
23:04
narrative or how a story should come out
23:06
or what you think on the front end and
23:08
therefore
23:08
exclude entire people and viewpoints and
23:11
ideas
23:12
i think is a really dangerous thing in
23:13
this country i agree and i i think it
23:16
also
23:16
it protects oddly enough by by creating
23:19
this narrative
23:20
it protects those with the most power
23:22
with the most cynical means
23:24
or most cynical ends um because those
23:26
are the ones that are able to pull the
23:27
strings either with you know uh
23:29
funding or with you know filling them
23:32
with the with the panelists that they
23:33
need and things like that
23:35
one example that that we gave on the
23:36
campaign trail about how these
23:38
narratives are so dangerous
23:39
is that uh with this covet 19 pandemic
23:43
most americans don’t realize that the
23:45
federal government didn’t allow covet
23:46
testing for nearly two months
23:48
for the first two months of the outbreak
23:50
and that that’s more than likely what
23:51
led to it spreading out of control is
23:53
that
23:53
for during the time that it could have
23:55
potentially been contained or at least
23:56
greatly slowed
23:57
no one was able to even test anyone to
23:59
know if they had it and that’s
24:01
never mentioned i i we we live stream
24:03
the debates and
24:04
we’re waiting for someone to mention
24:06
that fact and it was never mentioned
24:08
because it would it would damn both
24:10
republicans and democrats
24:12
and so because it because it would hurt
24:14
both sides
24:16
no one talked about it and it’s it’s a
24:18
very troubling thing so
24:20
i i guess you know you know what i want
24:23
to obviously besides reading your book
24:25
you know going obviously you’re going
24:26
out and buying your book and and reading
24:28
about it
24:28
what are the things that you think
24:31
people should be doing
24:32
today you know there’s only so much we
24:35
can do to demand from others what can
24:36
people be doing
24:37
in their choices their consuming choices
24:40
to try to
24:41
uh help or demand for there to be more
24:44
unbiased media out there
24:46
well continue to call out what you see
24:48
when it’s wrong and unfair don’t be
24:50
bullied by
24:51
what i call the box living in the box
24:53
which is where these interests want you
24:54
to live
24:55
they realize that if they can get you
24:57
totally relying on information on the
24:59
news and
25:00
online and on social media which they
25:02
can effectively
25:03
fairly well control that they can
25:05
basically control your access to almost
25:07
everything so don’t live in that box
25:09
don’t agree to do it
25:10
call it out when you see it don’t feel
25:12
bullied don’t let them make you think
25:14
which is what social media is designed
25:16
to do and the controlled by these
25:17
powerful interests whether it’s
25:19
wikipedia or snopes or
25:22
facebook twitter and so on the interests
25:25
that control it and have all kinds of
25:27
accounts and ways to put
25:29
a lot of narratives out there and you
25:31
know keep certain ones off
25:33
they want you to think you’re an outlier
25:35
when you’re not
25:36
for having a certain thought or a
25:38
feeling or an idea or wanting
25:40
information they want you to believe
25:42
you’re like one of the only ones that
25:44
want or want to hear it or
25:45
that something’s wrong with you so
25:48
listen to your cognitive dissonance when
25:50
you start getting those messages
25:52
and realize that this box is a piece of
25:54
information someone’s trying to
25:55
manipulate
25:56
quite successfully but live outside of
25:58
it you know when
25:59
when i travel around the country and
26:01
around the world there’s an entirely
26:03
different
26:03
impression i have of whether it’s how
26:06
people are getting along and what’s
26:07
happening in this country
26:08
than what you get if you go to these
26:10
information sources that are supposed to
26:12
gosh yeah
26:14
so trust that and just try to not let
26:16
yourself be liable to this
26:19
managed information landscape that
26:20
they’re trying to create
26:22
yeah i i just traveled all 35 states uh
26:26
70 campaign stops talked with tens of
26:28
thousands of people and it was it was
26:30
what you hear on tv and what you see on
26:33
social media
26:34
and the bits and pieces of what they try
26:35
to show you um you know uh
26:37
when people heard that i was going to
26:39
portland they’re like watch out there’s
26:40
you know
26:41
the city’s burning down and i went there
26:43
and there’s a part that
26:44
you know there was some uh difficult
26:47
things that were happening usually at
26:48
night
26:49
but most of the city was still really
26:51
they were much more ravaged by the
26:52
lockdowns
26:53
uh than they were by the by the protests
26:55
or the riots um
26:57
so when given the fact that our
27:01
news media uh environment right now
27:04
is overwhelmingly biased uh and that you
27:07
know
27:07
even on social media is also
27:10
increasingly biased with this
27:11
fact-checking stuff and you know sources
27:13
have discern determined this to be
27:15
untrue and all of that
27:16
what is the best way to try to find out
27:18
the truth we obviously can’t
27:20
be omnipresent so we have to rely on
27:23
getting information is it just getting
27:24
as many different sources as possible is
27:26
it
27:27
trying to find the primary source of
27:29
whatever the news thing is and find it
27:30
out for yourself like what
27:31
what is the best way for someone to try
27:33
to
27:34
get as unbiased as a picture as possible
27:37
given the the
27:38
the environment that they’re in right
27:39
now there are people working on this
27:42
problem so i think something will emerge
27:44
in the next four years because there are
27:45
technical people trying to create
27:47
platforms that can’t be de-platformed
27:49
when people are off the narrative and
27:50
simply reporting things the way they are
27:53
or studies or viewpoints that powerful
27:54
interests don’t want there are
27:56
journalists who want to do that kind of
27:57
reporting and there are investors who
27:59
want to invest in it so there’s people
28:01
looking to solve that problem but in the
28:02
meantime i think you use the tools that
28:05
they’re using against us
28:06
as cues so when twitter labels something
28:09
and says it’s not true or it’s been
28:11
debunked or challenged
28:12
that’s your cue to say someone powerful
28:15
doesn’t want me to look into this or to
28:17
believe it
28:17
it may be true and i need to dig further
28:20
find other sources like you say
28:22
in the last chapter of slanted i suggest
28:24
going to places like and i have a whole
28:26
list of places
28:28
real clear politics they will aggregate
28:31
left
28:31
and right and center so you may not get
28:34
an unbiased view of something but at
28:35
least
28:36
you can get a well-rounded view of what
28:37
both sides are saying
28:39
if you’re looking for something more in
28:41
this time
28:42
when things are shifting we don’t really
28:44
have a lot of unbiased sources to go to
28:47
i think you can find your own sources
28:49
left right center and otherwise
28:50
that you rely on for certain information
28:53
i like glenn greenwald for example who
28:55
leans
28:56
quite left but i like him on topics of
28:59
free speech free press government
29:01
manipulation
29:02
i like and these recommendations came
29:04
from some of my colleagues
29:06
david martin at cbs and pete williams at
29:08
nbc when it comes to national security
29:10
issues who report in what i think is a
29:13
unbiased fashion by and large not
29:15
seeming to be subjected to the beats
29:17
that they cover they don’t just vomit
29:19
out what the government tells them
29:21
and i name a whole host of people and
29:23
sources and outlets that i think you can
29:25
turn to and find your own sourcing
29:27
for the subjects that you care about and
29:29
lastly i know people don’t have time to
29:32
do this it’s almost not fair to say it
29:33
because that’s what the news was
29:35
supposed to do
29:36
but i tell people seek your own original
29:38
sourcing as much as possible and for me
29:40
that means
29:41
i go to c-span and i watch a hearing in
29:43
context
29:44
or a news conference in context and they
29:46
have a lot of it
29:47
and almost every time i come away with a
29:49
different takeaway
29:50
than what i saw reported on the news
29:52
when i see something that’s originally
29:54
sourced
29:55
you know as it actually happened which
29:57
would tell you a lot and if you have the
29:58
opportunity to do that
30:00
that’s the best thing you can do in this
30:02
time when the news is not really
30:05
i think being an honest arbiter of this
30:07
information
30:08
well those all sound like very good uh
30:10
recommendations and
30:11
cheryl i really appreciate you coming on
30:13
before i let you go i just want to give
30:14
you a chance to
30:15
say anything you feel like needed to be
30:17
said in the next few minutes that you
30:18
didn’t get a chance to say
30:19
plug anything you want to do as i always
30:22
do with all of my guests i give you the
30:23
last word
30:24
cheryl atkinson the floor is yours
30:27
well thank you i would just say um i
30:29
think the thing i think is most
30:31
important is telling people
30:32
the power lies in you if you’re not
30:34
subjected to these narratives and these
30:37
stories and you become more aware of it
30:39
it’s not successful and i look at
30:41
twitter i still use twitter some
30:43
i also use parlor which is not using
30:46
algorithms to
30:48
tamp down my reach as twitter and
30:50
facebook have drastically used in the
30:52
past couple of years
30:53
and i think if we think cerebrally about
30:56
it
30:57
if all the people leave twitter
31:00
who are who the powerful interests are
31:03
trying to manage they have nobody to
31:05
manage anymore they’re speaking to the
31:06
choir
31:07
it’s almost as if that goes away that
31:09
level of influence doesn’t exist for
31:11
them anymore we have to find ways
31:13
to kind of supersede these influences
31:16
that they’ve worked so hard to obtain we
31:18
hold the power we’re the product
31:20
they’re out to get us to think a certain
31:22
way
31:23
and by maintaining our own independence
31:25
and critical thinking
31:26
we kind of remove that marketability
31:28
that they have for us
31:29
and we can i think come out of this with
31:32
a different paradigm that’s something
31:34
different than this really sad sorry
31:35
state that we’ve come to today
31:37
right as i finally learned how to use
31:40
twitter uh you’re
31:41
saying no but you’re right you’re right
31:43
we have to do something so
31:45
uh i really appreciate your time cheryl
31:47
thank you again so much for coming on
31:48
and uh and i really appreciate it
31:50
thank you for having me appreciate it
31:52
and folks thank you for tuning in to
31:54
this uh
31:55
beginning of 2021 this first of 2021
31:58
episode of my fellow americans i am so
32:01
excited
32:02
to start this year with y’all uh this is
32:04
going to be fantastic we’re just getting
32:06
started
32:06
all sorts of fun stuff’s going to be
32:08
coming up in fact if you live anywhere
32:10
near sacramento california
32:12
come out and join me this weekend i will
32:14
be uh this saturday
32:15
at 4 p.m was that pacific time pacific
32:18
time local time
32:19
4 p.m uh in sacramento california i will
32:22
be
32:22
one of the speakers at the reopen
32:24
california now protest
32:26
uh we will be on the western steps of
32:29
the state capitol building
32:30
in beautiful downtown sacramento uh i’ll
32:33
be speaking about the harmful effects of
32:35
these absurd lockdowns and why they need
32:37
to end
32:38
so i’d love to if you if you live
32:40
anywhere near there come on out and
32:42
uh i’d love to meet you and talk to you
32:43
in person and uh be sure to
32:45
tune in have a great weekend either way
32:48
and then be sure to tune in next week
32:50
uh to uh my fellow americans well
32:52
actually wait
32:54
wait tune in next week for the next
32:57
episode of spike cohen’s culture of
33:00
winning where i will be speaking with
33:02
uh wendy hewitt who was recently elected
33:04
as a libertarian
33:05
and uh we will be talking about how she
33:07
got elected what she intends to do and
33:09
help to
33:09
build the blueprint for how libertarians
33:11
can get elected across the country and
33:13
then next tuesday
33:14
uh be sure to tune in at 8 o’clock for
33:16
the muddy waters of freedom where matt
33:17
wright and i parse through the week’s
33:19
events
33:19
like the what are we going to be for
33:23
2021
33:26
like the 2020 wonder boys that we are
33:29
and then uh tune in next week right here
33:32
same spike place
33:34
same spike time for another amazing
33:36
episode of my fellow americans
33:38
i’m spike cohen and you are the power
33:41
god bless guys
33:58
[Music]
34:26
[Music]
34:29
[Applause]
34:31
i can’t make a change
34:41
[Music]
34:46
if you
34:49
[Music]
34:56
[Music]
34:57
brings light to kindness all you need is
35:00
a sign
35:01
put a cease to the crimes but an east of
35:04
the minds like mine
35:05
sometimes darkness is all i find you
35:08
know what they say about an eye for a
35:09
night in a time when the blood is the
35:10
blood who am i to deny would grow when a
35:12
loved one dies
35:13
i recognize that body outside
35:42
there’s
35:45
[Music]
35:52
tell me why
36:04
[Music]
36:14
[Music]
36:23
we will make
36:30
[Music]
36:37
[Music]
36:51
you